Am I missing it? Numeric Scale?..

[WillBellJr]

Hi folks, today I'm attempting to do my work, (which I've always done in Fireworks) using Affinity Designer.

 

In particular I take high resolution images of the devices we manufacture, knock them out from their backgrounds and then split the full device into its individual components.

 

Typically, depending how how large the original images are, I work off a 3200 x 3200 canvas and scale the images down so I can fit all the individual components back together again >layer by layer< so I can create various "assemblies" for our "Device Configurator" website.

 

 

One of the first things I'm missing is a numeric scale??

 

In this case I need to make sure I scale each component down by the same amount so they all mate back together within my document.

 

I'm looking for a way to transform my images - scale in particular down by say 60% or so?

 

I can easily select the image and drag-scale, but for this task I'd rather have fields or similar where I could just type in 60 and have the image accurately (and repeatably) scale down by that amount?

 

I'm looking though the menus, but I don't see an option for that - I'm hoping I just need new glasses!

 

 

If not, PLEASE add in a way to numerically scale images!  For years now I've been looking for an app to replace my beloved Firework - AD is so close!

 

I was thinking I could actually do everything I need now with AD now, until I ran across this one omission...

 

 

-Will

 

[Oval]

No, you don’t need new glasses. Just the transform panel. Have a look into Affinity Designer Help. AD has a very powerful field input.

 

View ▹ Studio ▹ Transform

[WillBellJr]

Are you talking about the panel that is by default next to the Navigator and History?

 

That was the first panel I was looking at, but just now trying, I didn't realize I could just type 70% into the field - awesome!  Thanks, you saved my day!

 

-Will

[Oval]

Are you talking about the panel that is by default next to the Navigator and History?

 

“View ▹ Studio ▹ Transform” was not clear enough?!

 

Seems you and others haven’t found the power of the field input. Please have a look into Affinity Designer Help* and here.

 

* expressions for field input

[WillBellJr]

^And there you have it - totally didn't read / realize this was possible!  Thanks so much Oval (and Serif)!

 

I'm actually thinking I can totally do everything I need within Designer today on this new project - I may finally be free of my need for (buggy) Fireworks CS4 at this point!

 

Again, thanks for helping me, Oval, especially the pointer to the field expressions!

 

 

-Will

 

PS - In my defense, I typically always copy any PDF documentation to my dropbox and read it on my Kindle in my down time (my preferred way of learning my software).

 

If Serif could find it in its heart to create a PDF manual for Affinity Designer when its finalized (using your lovely, ahem, PagePlus perhaps), I for one would truly appreciate it.

[Oval]

Great to read that you are happy with AD. Search here for what you need: Some users have created an eBook (and PDF). And: Serif is working on a manual.

 

In defense of all users: Serif is great in hiding great features … like easter eggs

[WillBellJr]

Hi Oval, again, thanks for your help, I just wanted to report back that I've been successful!

 

I'm currently working though my task using Designer which I would have totally needed Fireworks for (as a side note, I'm not that much of a Photoshop fan, I've ALWAYS preferred FW over PS; it's my love of Vector artwork, and the ability to add bitmap styling along with the ease of edit-ability of vectors!)

 

The only thing I would do in FW which doesn't seem to work when I tried with AD was during the step to export final JPEGs from my source document (3200x3200) to my web-ready document (500x500).

 

I start off by having the two documents open, sitting side-by-side.

 

In FW, I would select all the various assemblies (layers) for the particular configuration being exported and >DRAG< the large source-layers over to the 500x500 document. (Which I then center snap to the document and then drag-scale down to fit within the 500x500 document).

 

In FW, this is essentially a COPY operation where it copies all the selected objects into the selected layer of the drop-target document. 

 

In Affinity Designer, it would just drop all the objects off in space where ever I released the mouse button to finalize the drag-drop operation, even though my cursor was over the 2nd, target document.

 

Of course I was able to get around this by doing a Copy / Paste to achieve the same, so no-harm-no-foul.  (It would be nice though, if you could drag - drop between open documents, within AD!)

 

 

Anyway, I'm straight!  I LOVE Affinity Designer, it has saved from my Extinction-ware that I've been forced to use for so long now, and believe me I've TRIED EVERY OTHER VECTOR package out there, none of them are as nice as AD, even in its Beta phase!

 

Kudos to Serif for having the courage to take on new development like this AND to the development team for putting out such high-quality work!

 

 

-Will

 

[Oval]

[???]

 

(It would be nice though, if you could drag - drop between open documents, within AD!)

 

BTW, Will: You can if you want …

[WillBellJr]

How Oval?  I just tried 3-times again just now?  The last time I even held down the CTRL key??

 

With all 3 of my layers selected, I click and drag left with the mouse over the other open document. When I let go, the document the mouse is over is still empty? and the objects on the original are moved to the left outside the workspace I have to click undo...

 

Holding down Alt ended up duplicating the selected objects - had to undo that.

 

 

Searching for drag-and-drop in the manual talks about the style panel, I'm just attempting to drag across pixel and image layers.

 

This is v1.5.0.10.

 

-Will

 

[Tupaia]

Hi!

I second the wish for numeric scale values / percents in the Transform panel (complementing the Width and Height values)!!!

 

You said somewhere a Scale Center is planned. Maybe when you go into that, you could also introduce scale values, to make the scaling workflow complete.

 

Thanks so much!!

Best

Eugen

[Oval]

I second the wish for numeric scale values / percents in the Transform panel (complementing the Width and Height values)!!!

 

What are you missing? Again, Tupaia: Please have a look into Affinity Designer Help* and here.

* expressions for field input

[Tupaia]

Hi, thanks!

I understand that, but as important and cool-to-have the field input expressions are, they are besides my point.
Let me say beforehand that I'm used to the thinking of 3D and CAD programs (which AD is or will be the perfect complement to), so bear with my lengthy answer:

 

When you click-and-drag-create any primitive object (e.g. a box) in Affinity Designer or some 3D program, you give it a certain width and height, meaning the boxes' points simply extend to that measure in 2d space.

Additionally, besides the geometric data (the spline points etc.), the object also has a transform matrix stored with it, which defines it's position, rotation, scale, shear.

Same in Affinity, of course. The values of this matrix is what is shown and can be edited in the Transform panel.

 

Say an object has an initial rotation of 0°. Rotate it, and the value changes. To reset the rotation, simply enter 0 again.

 

In the same way, an object has (or should have) an initial scale of 1,0 (or 100%). You should then be able to either interactively or numerically change this scale value  -that's my request.

The object has been scaled? Enter 1,0 (or 100%) again, and it resets to it's "initial" size.

 

 

For now, AD is only offerning the Width and Height to be entered numerically. Although this might often be what you want, there are cases where I don't want to think in terms of the actual size, but in scale.

Example:

There's a box with say width 25, height 25.

I want to have that box 4 times as big... I enter 25*4 in the numeric fields (so it's 100 ´then). Ugh, no, made up my mind, should have been 3 times as big...

To change that, as it is now, I would have to enter 100 * 0,75 (or use undo).

 

If there were a "Scale" numeric field also, you could just enter 3, and be done...

Or just enter 1 and have the object in it's initial size, without having to remember width or height.

 

 

This might be more useful for the "geometrical" or "technical" side of illustration... which exists, of course, and I hope AD will to some extent cater here, too, not just place itself as the next cool "artist tool".

(btw. I for my part study architecture, but also do hand-drawings and illustrations...)

Hope to get the point across...

 

Or is this already possible, and I'm missing something?

 

Cheers

Eugen

[Oval]

I enter 25*4

 

Too complicate (4 us) to reenter the value. Just w*4 or …

 

HTH

 

Sorry, no time 4 reading novels. Not a designer, right?

[Tupaia]

Ok, here's the short version:

Just add friggin' percentage/scale input fields, not only width/height! If you don't need scale values, don't use them. Some people do.

Expressions are nice, but something different.

 

Btw., I'm designer and tech mind at the same time. Goes well together.

 

Best

Eugen

[Oval]

scale values, don't use them. Some people do.

 

Thanks. Don’t think that Affinity will change their concept soon. Perhaps together with APu. w*n is OK for most users. Not too complicate to write w*4 or w*3/4 and memorize that.

[Tupaia]

Here's a screenshot of InDesign's "Transform panel". You can see it sports also percentage values besides W and H. That's what I mean.

 

 

By the way:

In the Transform panel, the box icon indicating the rotation (and hopefully scale!) center is missing an important mode: the Center icon as can be set in the viewport

 

Try it out: create an object, in the context toolbar click "Show Rotation Center", move it to some arbitrary place, and now in the Transform panel use the rotate slider. That ain't right, is it?

Made a feature request here already:

https://forum.affinity.serif.com/index.php?/topic/28936-rotation-center-also-in-transform-panel/

 

 

So here's what's missing for a nice, simple and consistent transform workflow:

Viewport:

- Rotate AND Scale tools both support the Centre mark

Transform panel:

- numeric rotation AND scale/percentage values

- numeric editing the rotate and scale values should support the viewport Centre mark

 

 

Thanks!

Best

Eugen

[Pixlers]

As a long-term professional designer, I fully agree with Tupai's suggestions. It would be very useful to have these input fields because they would allow more control over objects and symbols.

[appsmartvn]

Have a look into Affinity Designer Help.

[Tupaia]

Ok, done... and where does it say there are scale/percentage input fields?

[Oval]

Ok, done... and where does it say there are scale/percentage input fields?

Tupaia, we think this was a late answer for WillBellJr. Of course there are no new fields. They hopefully will come together with APu. Again: We don’t think that Affinity will change their concept soon, because it has not happened since your feature request. We have to be patient.

[Tupaia]

Fair enough, thanks for clarifying! =)

[Tupaia]

Hello!

Any update on that numeric 'Scale' input field (both width & height)? It's still missing.

One example case: for my architectural layout work, I often need a way to display plans in their original scale, or fractions/multiples of it. Once a plan has been scaled, how would I go back to the original size?

-> see the mockup of how the transform panel could look like.

And please also think about adding a switch for the Transform Origin - if it is turned on, numeric rotation/scale/shearing would take place around the Origin (not only center/corners).

Thanks a lot!

 

 

[Oval]

3 hours ago, Tupaia said:

Once a plan has been scaled, how would I go back to the original size?

Well, use the scale in your plan and W or H to scale it back. Simple math. In the powerful field input. You could also have the originally sized or resized plans in your document (or just rectangles) to use them as a scale (together with snapping or maths). If most users really need scale input fields, there should be many feature requests or something on the common feature requests index. What you can find is a suggestion for an additional factor (in the fields). And if you place a picture you get a percentage.

[Tupaia]

5 hours ago, Oval said:

Well, use the scale in your plan and W or H to scale it back. Simple math. In the powerful field input. You could also have the originally sized or resized plans in your document (or just rectangles) to use them as a scale (together with snapping or maths).

Thanks, I know. When there's no other way, we have to fall back to workarounds - but we want to work, not work around, right?

@Oval: you seem to have earned your respect around here with that many posts. However, since you repeatedly point me to the help about input field expression, which do NOT offer a solution for what I mean, I'm under the impression that you don't understand what it's about. Also, you are no Affinity representative, are you. This is a simple wish that makes sense. So I suggest to leave feature decisions to them, and to stop worrying if it comes your way or not.

Trying to make myself clearer, again:

True, when you enter a % value in the W or H field (thanks to expressions), it already does scale the object(s). However, this scale value is NOT remembered in the object's transform matrix (the little data package that stores pos, rot, scl, shr). The new size is 'baked' into the object's geometry, so to speak  (in a 3D program, this would be an "automatic scale freeze" or something analogous - in e.g. Cinema 4D, this is a dedicated UI button).

To restore an object's original size then, you would need to remember all the scales you did in the meantime, and enter the reciproke - too much hassle, although expressions would allow for it. Or use helper lines/objects. Not so nice, either.

 

What I propose is simply that the scale value is also remembered & exposed, just like position, rotation, shear. First, because it's consistent, second, because then you can reset objects to their original scale by simply entering 100% or 1.0. (I have to correct myself here. In my post from 21.11.2016  I thought InDesign does remember the %-value - it does not.)

 

5 hours ago, Oval said:

And if you place a picture you get a percentage.

Tried. I can't see where.

 

Aside from that scale thing, additionally, next to this box icon in the transform panel , there should be also the choice "Transform Origin". One should be able to numerically rotate/shear/scale around that freely positionable origin, too, not only interactively.

 

[Oval]

29 minutes ago, Tupaia said:

Trying to make myself clearer

You asked in a thread of WillBellJr. We answered. We gave you solutions that are possible in the apps, otherwise make a feature request in your own thread, otherwise your whishes could be ignored.