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TIFF files not displayed by OS X 10.11.6

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I, too am now exporting a file to send to a printer - When I export as CYMK 8-bit TIFF, it saves as a .png - which would be OK, except then it's also converted to RBG.

This is a pretty basic function - please tell me I'm doing something wrong.

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I just found out: You can export as tiff from the file menu, but not from the export persona. Just a simple bug I think.

I cannot - i've tried all methods and still end up with a big black blob. 

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Any update on this?  Just did my own test, and 16-bit tiff files produced from Affinity Photo are broken, while producing them from both Dxo Optics Pro 11 and Tonality CK produce tiffs which are fine.  

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I'm in the same boat.  I cannot export from the file menu, nor the export persona. 

 

The file size constraint may make some sense - I'm working on a 340mb photo which will not export correctly.  It is frustrating, especially since I can make the export tiff just fine from Exposure X, but not from Affinity.  And since Affinity is where all of my cloning takes place.... my workflow is halted, and it looks like it's going to be a while before this one (and others from this trip) goes off to my printer. 

 

Mac OS 10.11.6, Affinity photo 1.4.2.

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DonatoF,

 

If you open the exported 16 bit tiff in Affinity, is it still black?


Affinity Photo 1.7.3, Affinity Designer 1.7.3, Affinity Publisher 1.7.3; macOS High Sierra 10.13.6 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.155 & Affinity Designer 1.7.3.1 for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iPadOS 13.1.2

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R C-R

If you mean the Affinity produced tiff, it opens normally in Affinity, not black.  In Preview (and quick look) it is black, Tonality Pro is unable to open it at all ( "It may be damaged or use a file format that program doesn’t recognize."). However, DxO Optics Pro is able to open it ok.  Breaks my general monochrome workflow, which is usually develop the RAW in Dxo OP, export color 16 bit tiff, general tweaks in Affinity Photo, export as color 16 bit tiff, monochrome conversion in Tonality, then export to jpeg or whatever.  Not as much of an issue with images I keep in color, usually save the .afphoto file and just export jpegs.  Actually that lead me to a work-around - if I open the Affinity photo created tiff in DxO OP, then re-export it as a tiff, I then have one that behaves normally. Just have to remember to not apply any preset in DxO.  Kind of clumsy, but will work for now.

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It was reported in CaptureONE forum that that 10.11.6 breaks the compatibility of tiling. In my work flow, I use both C1 and Affinity.   It turned out that if I create an tif file with a tiling of 128, it can display in preview, however, it will crash Affinity, Affinity is not able to open such a file.  So, I have to revert back to no compressed with no tiling.  Hopes this will help in debugging the issue.  Not sure what tiling does to the file format though.

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Not sure what tiling does to the file format though.

As I understand it, tiles can appear in any order in the file. Four tags identify tile width, tile length, tile offset in the file, & number of bytes (optionally compressed) of the tile. They are all part of the Extension TIFF tag group which, according to the TIFF specifications, not all TIFF readers are required to support.

 

The alternative to storing image data in TIFF files as tiles is to store it as strips, which all readers must support.


Affinity Photo 1.7.3, Affinity Designer 1.7.3, Affinity Publisher 1.7.3; macOS High Sierra 10.13.6 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.155 & Affinity Designer 1.7.3.1 for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iPadOS 13.1.2

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I would vote for Affinity Photo to release a patch that changes the tile storing mechanism so as to avoid this problem. Seems silly to sit around and wait for Apple to make a move while all of us are stuck without a workaround.

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The only way to avoid the problem with OS X 10.11.6 is not to store tiff image data as tiles.


Affinity Photo 1.7.3, Affinity Designer 1.7.3, Affinity Publisher 1.7.3; macOS High Sierra 10.13.6 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.155 & Affinity Designer 1.7.3.1 for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iPadOS 13.1.2

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It is far from a perfect solution because how Affinity stores TIFF files is not the problem; it is that (only) OS X 10.11.6 does not process large tiled TIFF files properly. So changing how Affinity stores them won't fix the same problem that occurs in other apps that use Apple's API to process tiled TIFFs, nor will it fix existing documents without importing & reexporting them.

 

Besides, there are good technical reasons to store TIFF images as tiles. The main one is the lossless compression algorithms that keep TIFF file sizes manageable work much more efficiently with 2D data tiles than 1D strips, so storing the data as compressed strips will result in considerably larger files. Tiles are also considerably more memory efficient for things like zooming in on one part of an image (since only the tiles containing that part of the image need to be in the memory buffer).


Affinity Photo 1.7.3, Affinity Designer 1.7.3, Affinity Publisher 1.7.3; macOS High Sierra 10.13.6 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.155 & Affinity Designer 1.7.3.1 for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iPadOS 13.1.2

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Hi,

 

Thanks for the further information - it's very useful..

 

Although I don't really want to change Affinity for no reason (this is an Apple bug, as I understand it) - I will add it to my list of things to investigate during the beta. It's probably not acceptable for our app to generate TIFF files which cannot be previewed by macOS..

 

I'll also pass the bug report onto Apple - although they appear to have already fixed it in macOS Sierra - so I would expect the fix to be back ported to 10.11 for the next release.

 

Thanks,

 

Andy.

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... so I would expect the fix to be back ported to 10.11 for the next release.

... assuming there is one before Sierra is released.  :(

 

Andy, it might help us understand this better if we knew if Affinity always exported tiffs as tiles, & if the tile size is fixed or changes depending on some characteristic of the file or of the tiff export options. Any hope of enlightening us a bit on that?


Affinity Photo 1.7.3, Affinity Designer 1.7.3, Affinity Publisher 1.7.3; macOS High Sierra 10.13.6 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.155 & Affinity Designer 1.7.3.1 for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iPadOS 13.1.2

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R C-R,

 

Certainly,

 

We are setting: 

 

PLANARCONFIG_CONTIG,COMPRESSION_LZW,PREDICTOR_HORIZONTAL (of note - everything else is boilerplate libtiff defaults): 

 

I have a feeling that our issue is that we are setting TIFFTAG_ROWSPERSTRIP to the height of the image, where we should possibly be setting it to zero ("If the request is <1 then we choose a strip size according to certain heuristics.") Those "certain heuristics" could be important ;)

 

We're also a couple of sub-point releases behind with libtiff - which I will rectify shortly.

 

I'm sure we can get this resolved.

 

Thanks,

 

Andy.

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Andy, thanks for the info. About 95% of it is way over my head but I do get the "'certain heuristics' could be important" part.  :lol:

 

I wonder if the setting the ROWSPERSTRIP tag to the (pixel?) height of the image could explain why I only see the issue with tiff exports above some size? I guess it doesn't matter much but maybe I will do some tests to see if there is some maximum image height below which the issue doesn't occur.


Affinity Photo 1.7.3, Affinity Designer 1.7.3, Affinity Publisher 1.7.3; macOS High Sierra 10.13.6 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.155 & Affinity Designer 1.7.3.1 for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iPadOS 13.1.2

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Guys,

 

I'm pleased to say we have fixed this - it didn't make todays Designer update, but will be available in the next beta of both Photo and Designer.

 

Turns out we should be setting TIFFTAG_ROWSPERSTRIP to zero - then it works it out by itself and everything is fine :)

 

Thanks again to everyone in this thread for your help with this..

 

Andy.

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I too have this problem. I get the black box preview when I export 16bit .TIFFs. Files are about 140 megs. Same problem when I go to 8 bit.

.JPEG has same issue.

Also when I save and go back to Aperture, it says the image is an unsupported format.

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I too have this problem. I get the black box preview when I export 16bit .TIFFs. Files are about 140 megs. Same problem when I go to 8 bit.

.JPEG has same issue.

Also when I save and go back to Aperture, it says the image is an unsupported format.

I have the EXACT same problem.  It wasn't there before.  Whats the fix without changing my OS?

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The problem remain for tiff export with the last update 1.4.3.

It is Ok with 8 bits but white or black with 16 bits.

Mac OS 10.11.6

Picture 6000x4000 px

best

post-7608-0-89893300-1474361321_thumb.png

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Hi jfg,

Welcome to Affinity Forums :)

The 1.4.3 version is just a minor update to ensure compatibility with macOS Sierra. It doesn't contain any bug fixes pertaining to other features.

Tiff export issues should be addressed in the next Mac App Store update (version 1.5) expected around October if everything goes well.

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