CTRL+PageDn, Ctrl+PageUp.... Why reinvent the wheel?

[anto]

Why use such a complicated keyboard shortcut by default when PageDn, PageUp, Insert, etc. work without the Ctrl key? In all programs, they work independently. Why complicate life and make the user reassign obvious things?

[MikeTO]

3 hours ago, anto said:

Why use such a complicated keyboard shortcut by default when PageDn, PageUp, Insert, etc. work without the Ctrl key? In all programs, they work independently. Why complicate life and make the user reassign obvious things?

I assume the shortcut was chosen to align to Adobe InDesign because it's useful to use the same shortcuts to help those switching to Affinity.

InDesign uses Page Up and Down without a modifier to move to the first or last line of text in a text frame. AFAIK, Affinity lacks that feature so the unmodified keys could be used for a different purpose but I'd rather Affinity just add those missing commands.

[anto]

4 minutes ago, MikeTO said:

I assume the shortcut was chosen to align to Adobe InDesign because it's useful to use the same shortcuts to help those switching to Affinity.

 

This is not the case. In Affinity, everything is inside out, so it's not like Indesign. When you move between pages in Indesign, you use the PageDn, PageUp, Home, End keys without any Ctrl.

[MikeTO]

54 minutes ago, anto said:

When you move between pages in Indesign, you use the PageDn, PageUp, Home, End keys without any Ctrl.

I think you may be mistaken. The InDesign shortcuts help page states that Page Up/Down without modifiers is for "Move to first/last row in frame" while Ctrl/Cmd + Page Up/Down is for "Go back/forward to last-viewed page".

[anto]

2 hours ago, MikeTO said:

I think you may be mistaken.

I don't understand why in many cases on the forum here I have to explain obvious things and waste time on it.
Watch the video. I just press the buttons on the keyboard that say PageDown, PageUp, Home and End, which is obvious from the inscription.

 

[anto]

Buttons Ctrl+PageUp, Ctrl+PageDown don't work at all in the text frame of the Indesign.
Only Ctrl+Home and Ctrl+End work, which respectively move the cursor to the beginning of the frame or the end.
The Home and End buttons in the text frame move the cursor to the beginning of the line and the end of the line, respectively.
 

[anto]

Even MS Word adheres to standards and what it writes on the keyboard buttons.

The Home and End buttons move the cursor to the beginning of the line and the end of the line, respectively.

PageDn, PageUp you can move between pages.
Ctrl+Home and Ctrl+End which respectively move the cursor to the beginning of the text or the end.

[Old Bruce]

My experience on Mac has been.

Home and End should move to the first and last page.*

The left and right arrow keys move forward and backwards by characters, words or the line. Depending on whether or not a modifier key is used. The up and down arrow keys move up or down a line, a paragraph or the entire text flow. Again depending on which modifier key is used.

 

* I say should because currently Affinity Publisher does not utilize the home key on its own to move to the beginning/first page of the document. It is the only Mac application I have that requires a modifier key to be added to it. The Page Up, Page Down, and End keys will work with or without a modifier key added to the shortcut.

[Obscured]

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[MikeTO]

My apologies, I was looking at InDesign's shortcuts for editing tables. InDesign does use Page Up/Down without a modifier to move up and down one page (as you reported). Ctrl+Page Up/Down is used for back/forward last-viewed page.

Therefore Affinity does not use the same shortcut as InDesign to do this and Page Up/Down without a modifier isn't used for any other purpose in any of the three apps so I can't think of any reason why this shortcut was chosen.

I changed these shortcuts on my own computer immediately after buying Affinity. I save my customized shortcuts to a file for each of the three apps so I don't worry about the defaults too often.

11 minutes ago, Return said:

Mac is the preferred OS and everything is based upon it.
Windows is in their eyes the inferior OS because it doesn't have strict rules although they exist.
To bad Serif only has windows versions because its users are paying the bills since it is and will be the bigger OS.

This isn't a Mac vs. PC issue and this default shortcut is less convenient for Mac laptops which don't have Page Up/Down keys like Windows laptops. This makes the default shortcut for Mac laptops to be Fn+Cmd+Up/Down Arrow.

[Obscured]

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[walt.farrell]

14 hours ago, Return said:

But like you stated, I would rather have the user decide and setup the shortcuts and have creatives use what suits them best instead of hardcoded and nonsensical default keys.

Perhaps I've misunderstood that, but you seem to have said that you would prefer there be no default shortcut for this, so everyone has to set it up.

If I got that right, I don't see that it helps. It means that everyone has to set them, rather than (as now) only some subset of users having to set them. 

The capability to set them is there, and every user can already set them as they like them, if the default doesn't work well for them.

[walt.farrell]

In any case, using Ctrl+PageUp or PageDown means that when you are zoomed in such that the entire page does not fit on the screen, PageUp and PageDown can be used to move within the current page, which is perhaps more common than moving between pages for many users and scenarios. And then adding the modifier lets you move between pages. But each user can set that as they like.

[Alfred]

15 hours ago, Return said:

hardcoded and nonsensical default keys

 

4 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

The capability to set them is there, and every user can already set them as they like them, if the default doesn't work well for them.

If they’re hardcoded, they’re set to something that can’t be changed; if they’re default keys (nonsensical or otherwise!) then they can be changed. It therefore isn’t possible for them to be both hardcoded and default keys.

[Obscured]

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[bbrother]

InDesign:

• Page Up/Page Down: Scroll up/down one screen.

• Alt + Page Up/Alt + Page Down: Move to previous/next spread.

Affinity Publisher:

• Scroll Wheel: Scroll vertically.

• Shift + Scroll Wheel: Scroll horizontally.

• Ctrl + Page Up/Ctrl + Page Down: Move to previous/next page.

Key Points:

• Scrolling = Moving view up/down within the same page.

• Page Navigation = Moving to a different page/spread.

@anto

You're mixing up these functionalities. InDesign uses Page Up/Page Down for scrolling, while Publisher uses Ctrl + Page Up/Page Down for navigation. The difference isn’t about reinventing the wheel, but differentiating between scrolling and navigation.

[anto]

17 minutes ago, bbrother said:

InDesign:

• Page Up/Page Down: Scroll up/down one screen.

In Affinity Ctrl + Page Up/Ctrl+Page Down

[carl123]

22 minutes ago, bbrother said:

You're mixing up these functionalities. InDesign uses Page Up/Page Down for scrolling, while Publisher uses Ctrl + Page Up/Page Down for navigation. The difference isn’t about reinventing the wheel, but differentiating between scrolling and navigation.

Publisher also uses Page Up/Page Down for scrolling by one screen when in the Pages Panel

(But the current page you are working on does not change)

[anto]

27 minutes ago, bbrother said:

InDesign:

• Page Up/Page Down: Scroll up/down one screen.

• Alt + Page Up/Alt + Page Down: Move to previous/next spread.

Affinity Publisher:

• Scroll Wheel: Scroll vertically.

• Shift + Scroll Wheel: Scroll horizontally.

• Ctrl + Page Up/Ctrl + Page Down: Move to previous/next page.

Key Points:

• Scrolling = Moving view up/down within the same page.

• Page Navigation = Moving to a different page/spread.

@anto

You're mixing up these functionalities. InDesign uses Page Up/Page Down for scrolling, while Publisher uses Ctrl + Page Up/Page Down for navigation. The difference isn’t about reinventing the wheel, but differentiating between scrolling and navigation.

Moreover, if I have a page with a header, then according to your logic, when I press Ctrl+PageDown, I should move to the next page (spread) to the same header. But Publisher throws me somewhere in the middle of the page.

 

[bbrother]

On 12/20/2024 at 10:18 PM, MikeTO said:

InDesign does use Page Up/Down without a modifier to move up and down one page (as you reported).

Not exactly @MikeTO

Actually, in InDesign, using Page Up and Page Down without a modifier doesn't necessarily move the view by one page height. Instead, these keys scroll the document view up or down by the height of the current viewport, which depends on your zoom level and screen size. This means the scroll amount can vary and is not fixed to a single page height. Additionally, this action is about scrolling within the current view rather than moving to a specific page.

 

3 hours ago, anto said:

Moreover, if I have a page with a header, then according to your logic, when I press Ctrl+PageDown, I should move to the next page (spread) to the same header. But Publisher throws me somewhere in the middle of the page.

Affinity Publisher currently maintains the zoom level but resets the vertical and horizontal position to the center of the new page when navigating using Ctrl+Page Up/Down. While I'm not certain if this behavior is by design or a bug, it could definitely be improved.