text resizes when Text Frames linked across pages

[Dennison]

I think this has been highlighted before- but the latest I can find is 2018.  Yet the bug seems to persist.

 

Create new Text Frame - type text - all okay

Link that new Text Frame to an existing Text Frame on the next page AND - the text goes from 12pt to 2.5pt

see screenshots

When the mini text is selected and correct Test Style is applied - 10 pt - the text in the first Text Frame is okay but the overflow jumps to 41 pt, even though that text in that Frame originally also had the same Text Style

 

any update on a solution would be welcome.

[MikeTO]

The frame you linked to has content scaling. You can tell because the content scaling handle in its bottom right corner is solid blue (this is a new feature of 2.5). Double-click that content scaling handle to restore to the normal scaling.

Resize text frames from the inner bottom-right size handle to avoid this in the future.

Cheers

[Dennison]

Thanks Mike.

I was not aware of the new feature.

However, the Text Frame was not resized. It was not touched and the Frame was created before V2.5

After creating the Text Frame on the left - with "normal" font size - the only change was to link the two Frames.  So why does that trigger a leap from 10 pt to 2.5 pt.   And then from 10pt to 41 pt. 

 

I will keep my eye on this - because it happened a lot even before this new feature was introduced - to ensure the outer circle is not selected and see if it still goes crazy.

 

I see now that every pre-V2.5 Text Frame has this new feature applied, but new Text Frames do not.  When I double click to remove - the text leaps to 2.5 pt.

 

Maybe this is an ancient inherited setting of a Text Frame long ago that gets duplicated - I would like to see a setting for a Default Text Frame instead of the current "inherited" settings.

[walt.farrell]

12 minutes ago, Dennison said:

However, the Text Frame was not resized. It was not touched and the Frame was created before V2.5

It doesn't matter when it was created. The rescaling function has always existed, it was just impossible to know easily that it had been used until 2.5 started exposing that fact by making the rescaling node solid blue.

If Publisher says it was rescaled, then it most likely was, perhaps when it was initially created.

If you start with 10 pt text on a non-scaled frame, and flow it into a scaled frame, it will become smaller or larger depending on exactly how you rescaled that frame. Then, flowing out of that scaled frame into a non-scaled frame (or a differently-scaled frame) it will again become smaller or larger. 

As Mike said, double-click that solid blue handle to fix the problem, then adjust the text size if necessary. 

19 minutes ago, Dennison said:

Maybe this is an ancient inherited setting of a Text Frame long ago that gets duplicated - I would like to see a setting for a Default Text Frame instead of the current "inherited" settings.

Select a Text Frame, then use Edit > Defaults > Revert. Then set the frame as you want it, and with the frame selected use Edit > Defaults > Synchronize from Selection, then Edit > Defaults > Save.

22 minutes ago, Dennison said:

I will keep my eye on this - because it happened a lot even before this new feature was introduced

It was known to happen in some cases with files that started as IDML files, due to a bug. 

But it is guaranteed to happen if you ever use the rescaling handle on a Text Frame and then link that frame to another. 

[Hangman]

11 hours ago, Dennison said:

However, the Text Frame was not resized. It was not touched and the Frame was created before V2.5

Hi @Dennison,

As @MikeTO and @walt.farrell mention above, the text frame scaling will likely have happened when the initial version of the book was created... as this was before v2.5 it is unlikely that you would have spotted it because the solid blue dot for the text frames' scale handle wasn't incorporated back then...

The text in the frame on the right-facing page indicates that the text frame was rescaled at some point in its life and the text in that frame was changed back to the original font size. The issue is that the text frame itself is still scaled giving a false impression of the font size for the text that appears within it, i.e., the 12 pt text in that text frame is not 12 pt but is 2.5 pt scaled to 12 pt...

This means when creating a new 'unscaled' text frame and linking to the scaled text frame the text in the newly created text frame is also unscaled and subsequently shows the text at its correct size, i.e., 2.5 pt.

Again, as mentioned above, once linked this issue can now be easily resolved by double-clicking the solid blue dot on the text frames' scale handle at the bottom right of the text frame which will change the now oversized text in the right-hand facing page text frame back to its unscaled size of 12 pt...

Alternatively, you could double-click the solid blue dot on the text frames' scale handle at the bottom right of the text frame before linking to the new frame which will change the text in the frame back to its unscaled size of 2.5 pt, then apply your text style so the text is now unscaled and 12 pt. This means when linking the text frame to your new text frame text scaling won't occur because neither text frame has any scaling applied...

[woefi]

Oh Wow. I had this too when importing IDML files in the past.

Now, with V2 2.5, we finally "see" what was happening all the time. Why did nobody ever mention this? I searched the help file but there is no explanation of "content scaling" or how you would get rid of it.

So how do I "repair" all my somewhat finished documents, which many have slightly modified text styles or no styles at all, mixed inside a single text box?

1. There better be a "override scaling BUT convert text sizes to match current appearance"-button.
2. How would be the proper way to scale a bunch of text boxes and graphical elements to a new permanent scale?

[Hangman]

Hi @woefi,

This 'feature' appears in the Help section under 'Fitting Text to Frames'...

https://affinity.help/publisher2/English.lproj/index.html?page=pages/Text/fittingFrameText.html&title=Fitting text to frames

57 minutes ago, woefi said:

So how do I "repair" all my somewhat finished documents, which many have slightly modified text styles or no styles at all, mixed inside a single text box?

1. There better be a "override scaling BUT convert text sizes to match current appearance"-button.

Ideally, you would have text styles set up for every aspect of your book which can be applied to the appropriate text but you would likely have to go through your book and check each text frame to see whether or not the text frame has any scaling applied and if it does, double-click the text frame's object's scale handle to reset the frame text's scale back to 100% and then apply the appropriate text styles to your text or for text with no style apply the text formatting manually...

1 hour ago, woefi said:

How would be the proper way to scale a bunch of text boxes and graphical elements to a new permanent scale?

Use the resize handles rather than the object scale handle, practically this is likely to be the centre-right or centre-bottom resize handles... if the text frame is grouped with other objects you can hold Shift when resizing the group to maintain the aspect ratio though you will likely have to reposition the graphics after resizing...

[woefi]

Thank You for pointing to the correct help page, @Hangman 

 

I know how to work with text styles, but often times it is the exact opposite way how they are created:

You (creatively) play around with some headline/bodytext/graphical elements regarding weight, size, color, etc. and maybe scale the whole combo up or down so it uses the same relational appearance. After you (or your client) like the result of this prototype, you "cast" these different text parts into styles and begin the duller part of the work - adhering to these styles.

As it is now, you would first have to "reset" (but the other way around) the text so that it sticks to its current sizes.

My personal use-case is not about books. It's more like I have a brochure/folder and need to make a poster and a half page ad with the same typo+graphical elements - obviously in different sizes and aspect ratios but with the same look-and-feel.

 

 

 

 

[Dennison]

Fascinating. Not sure I really follow.

I understand the words – the 12 pt text in that text frame is not 12 pt but is 2.5 pt scaled to 12 pt... - but not the purpose. So Text Styles are only provisional - there is actually another factor that can screw everything up. 

 

So does this mean that every new Text Frame that starts in the top left on a page and is dragged out to the bottom right is being "rescaled"?

How can any Text Frame be created without "scaling"?

Is 2.5pt the "default" size for all new Text Frames?

[Hangman]

1 minute ago, Dennison said:

So does this mean that every new Text Frame that starts in the top left on a page and is dragged out to the bottom right is being "rescaled"?

No...

A Text Frame is only Rescaled when using the Rescale handle, i.e. the lower of the two handles at the bottom right of a text frame. If you use the Resize handles, i.e. any handle other than the Resale handle then text scaling will not occur. either in-frame or when linking to other text frames...
 

6 minutes ago, Dennison said:

How can any Text Frame be created without "scaling"?

By using the Resize handles rather than the Rescale handle...
 

3 minutes ago, Dennison said:

Is 2.5pt the "default" size for all new Text Frames?

No...

The default size is Arial Regular 12 pt for all text frames...

[walt.farrell]

59 minutes ago, Hangman said:

The default size is Arial Regular 12 pt for all text frames...

The default from the factory, yes, but of course the user may establish their own defaults.

[Hangman]

Just now, walt.farrell said:

The default from the factory, yes, but of course the user may establish their own defaults.

They may... I was referencing the factory defaults...

[Dennison]

Thank you for all the helpful replies - one learns much new every day!