You cannot create group for symbol layer

[NotMyFault]

Hi,

I often create a group with a symbol layer inside, allows me to deactivate a single instance on group level without deactivating sync. This does not work on iPad, as the UI mistakes a symbol as group and only offers to ungroup which would destroy the symbol instance.

[loukash]

Top bar > "…" menu > Operations > Group

[NotMyFault]

Thank you for the workaround, never the less this should be fixed.

[loukash]

I'm not sure it's a bug in the first place, since a Symbol layer is essentially a group object.

[NotMyFault]

Similar to vector layers and other layer types who show blend  mode passtrough.

There are more bugs related to symbols mixed up with groups when used with constraint groups. Symbols have special abilities which normal groups don’t have.

Why are only symbols misinterpreted, but vector layers not?

[walt.farrell]

16 hours ago, NotMyFault said:

This does not work on iPad, as the UI mistakes a symbol as group and only offers to ungroup which would destroy the symbol instance.

What action in the UI is causing that problem? (That is, what are you doing to trigger this issue?)

[loukash]

1 hour ago, NotMyFault said:

Similar to vector layers and other layer types who show blend  mode passtrough.

But vector layers are still a different object type, having infinite boundaries, for example.
Whereas Symbol layers are technically closer to groups or Warp groups. They all share other very similar characteristics that e.g. vector layers don't have.

I think the confusion arises from the object name: It should be called Symbol Group, akin to the Warp Group.

[Dan C]

Thanks for your report @NotMyFault!

Personally I would expect this Group menu in the Layers Studio to offer the 'Group' option when a Symbol layer is selected and not the 'Ungroup' option.

Although Symbol Layers are technically Groups, I don't believe that 'Ungroup' should show as this removes the synced Symbol instance from the file and it should be the default behaviour to add the Symbol itself to a new Group layer.

Therefore I've logged this with our developers as a bug for you now. I hope this helps

[NotMyFault]

13 minutes ago, loukash said:

I think the confusion arises from the object name: It should be called Symbol Group, akin to the Warp Group.

I would object in this case.

a symbol allows only one single child object when creating it (otherwise multiple symbols will be created, one per selected layer), so I mostly group layers first to be able to create a symbol. It makes no sense to call it symbol group if it is not grouping at all. 

[loukash]

Just now, NotMyFault said:

a symbol allows only one single child object when creating it, so I mostly group layers first to be able to create a symbol. It makes no sense to call it symbol group if it is not grouping at all. 

Fair enough, I forgot about this…  

[loukash]

On the other hand, to convert a Symbol instance back to regular object, you simply ungroup it.

Could it be that …

10 minutes ago, NotMyFault said:

a symbol allows only one single child object when creating it

… is in fact a bug?
Or at least a "conceptual oversight"?
For what it's worth, it's the same behavior in v1.10 (on desktop; I never had v1 for iPad).

[Dan C]

6 minutes ago, loukash said:

Could it be that …

14 minutes ago, NotMyFault said:

a symbol allows only one single child object when creating it

… is in fact a bug?
Or at least a "conceptual oversight"?

As I understand it - this is expected behaviour with Symbols.

Creating a selection of multiple individual objects and then creating a Symbol from this selection will create a separate Symbol for each object selected.

Creating a selection of multiple individual objects, Grouping these together and then creating a Symbol from selection will create a Symbol of the Group itself, including any child layers within.

This is briefly covered in the relevant helpfile page here:

Quote

To create a symbol:

1. Select one or more objects or groups on the page or via the Layers panel

Therefore I believe this is how the developers have designed Symbols to work with multiple object selections and singular child layers  

[loukash]

45 minutes ago, Dan C said:

This is briefly covered in the relevant helpfile page

Hm…
So, semantically, to create "a symbol" – which I would naturally read as "one symbol" – we should be able to select "one or more objects".

Pardon me if I'm nitpicking here…  

49 minutes ago, Dan C said:

Therefore I believe this is how the developers have designed Symbols to work with multiple object selections and singular child layers

… but then the documentation is not correct.

[Dan C]

On 1/15/2024 at 1:41 PM, loukash said:

Pardon me if I'm nitpicking here…  

On 1/15/2024 at 12:49 PM, Dan C said:

Therefore I believe this is how the developers have designed Symbols to work with multiple object selections and singular child layers

… but then the documentation is not correct.

Apologies, I agree the helpfile could do with some clarification here - similar to the below edit perhaps?

Quote

To create a symbol:

1. Select one object or group on the page or via the Layers panel.
2. Do one of the following:

• On the Symbols panel, click Create.
• On the Layer menu, select Create Symbol.

You can create a symbol from an object present in an existing symbol.
With multiple objects or groups selected, each individual object/group will be created as a separate Symbol.

I'll be sure to log this with the documentation team for further consideration

[loukash]

31 minutes ago, Dan C said:

similar to the below edit perhaps?

Yeah, that reads more like what's going to happen.