Can global colours dragged from another file be "collected" in a swatch palette?

[k_au]

In the attached file are shapes that use global colours. The objects were originally made in ADesigner v1.x, later edited in the Designer Persona in APub and then dragged copy-and-pasted from existing files to new files.

Now I see the names like "Globale Farbe 18" in the "Colour" tab, but I don't see them anywhere under the "swatches" tab. 

Is there a way to have the existing global colours show up in a swatch palette?

globalcolour_nopalette.afpub

Edited December 14, 2023 by k_au
Clarification

[k_au]

I noticed that there's a menu option "Palette aus Dokument erstellen" (create palette from document). I chose this and then "create document palette". In the resulting palette the colours are all there but they are not linked to the objects, they are not global colours, they don't use the existing global colours' names.

IMHO that's not really helpful when working with bigger projects.

[Old Bruce]

If I understand correctly I believe that you didn't export the palette from the origninal v1 document. That is how Global Colours (which are a Document specific feature, not actually "global" in scope) are imported into the Palettes pane.

Create a Document Palette, fill it with colours, global or otherwise. Export the palette. Make a new document and import the Palette, now you have your colours, both global and otherwise.

I have no idea why the colours in your document have names. I also have no idea how you put them into the new document. The following description just confuses me. Did the v1 file have the global colours in a Document Palette? I assume you opened the v1 file in Publisher (whether v1 or v2 I don't know). How did you "drag" the (globally coloured(?)) objects into a new document?

32 minutes ago, k_au said:

The objects were originally made in ADesigner v1.x, later edited in the Designer Persona in APub and then dragged from existing files to new files.

 

[walt.farrell]

You must have a Document Palette (Add Document Palette, from the Swatches panel) before you can have Global Colors.

Even then, copying a Global Color from one document to another will not automatically get you a Global Color in the second document. You would need to add it to a Document Palette there, too.

For larger projects, you could have a Template document with a Document Palette with your Global Colors defined, and start all your documents from that Template. Or you could Export a .afpalette file from your Document Palette, and Import it into your other documents.

But as you make changes in one document they won't be picked up in the other documents. Global is global only in a single document.

[k_au]

Thanks, both of you, I was just writing more about what I found out so I'll drop this here first before I answer your points.
 

I've noticed again that it's impossible to select more than one swatch at a time to turn them into global swatches 😭 This makes working with imported palettes a chore.

And to boot, I found that the swatches that were "created from document" seem to be LAB colours, and not the CMYK that was actually used in the document?! So it's creating a palette of swatches that are almost, but not quite, entirely unlike what's expected 😬
Can anyone confirm this? 

I think I really want linked palettes with global colour swatches. All the corporate colours of one client neatly in one palette, and quickly imported into a new project, and quickly updated when a new colour is introduced or an existing colour needs a change.

As I said before, I think the use of non-global swatches is very very limited. And it's a real bummer that linked / application palettes can't have global swatches.

[k_au]

23 minutes ago, Old Bruce said:

I have no idea why the colours in your document have names. I also have no idea how you put them into the new document. The following description just confuses me. Did the v1 file have the global colours in a Document Palette? I assume you opened the v1 file in Publisher (whether v1 or v2 I don't know). How did you "drag" the (globally coloured(?)) objects into a new document?

 

Actucally I reproduced it just now with the latest APub on Win 10:
Open a new project, draw a shape, make a new document palette, add the shape's colour as a global colour, edit the name in the palette if you want.

Then open another new project, don't close the first one. Copy and paste the shape from the first project into the new one. The shape will still use the global colour, but this colour will not show up in a document palette - there is none. But even if you make a new document palette before pasting the shape, the global colour won't be added to that palette.

I was wrong about drag-n-dropping, seems that does not work between document windows.

[Old Bruce]

Just now, k_au said:

Then open another new project, don't close the first one. Copy and paste the shape from the first project into the new one. The shape will still use the global colour, but this colour will not show up in a document palette - there is none. But even if you make a new document palette before pasting the shape, the global colour won't be added to that palette.

Global colours live in Document Palettes. If you don't first export and then import the Document Palette you won't have Global Colours. We can argue with, suggest a feature request to, the people at Affinity that it should be otherwise but right now it is what it is.

[k_au]

34 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

You must have a Document Palette (Add Document Palette, from the Swatches panel) before you can have Global Colors.

Actually, it looks like you can copy a global color (see above) but you can't get that swatch.

Quote

Even then, copying a Global Color from one document to another will not automatically get you a Global Color in the second document. You would need to add it to a Document Palette there, too.

Well, in my case it stays global as I made a few more duplicates of the shape and was able to change all their colours at once when editing the global colour via the colour panel.

Quote

For larger projects, you could have a Template document with a Document Palette with your Global Colors defined, and start all your documents from that Template. Or you could Export a .afpalette file from your Document Palette, and Import it into your other documents.

I think importing a .afpalette before starting a new document will probably be what I'll do.
Importing the palette will not work with existing global swatches, they don't "link" automatically. So I will have to export the palette from the original design, and import that into every new file before copying the design into the new file (if I want to change the colours of the design in that new file). As long as the colours don't change (e.g. for the logo) it's probably not worth worrying about this.

Quote

But as you make changes in one document they won't be picked up in the other documents. Global is global only in a single document.

Yes, thats a bummer. Maybe exporting a new .afpalette and importing into an existing file might work? 

(I see a notice that there has been a new reply in the time I took to compose this post (compost?)  so if it looks out of place blame me)

[k_au]

32 minutes ago, Old Bruce said:

Global colours live in Document Palettes. If you don't first export and then import the Document Palette you won't have Global Colours. We can argue with, suggest a feature request to, the people at Affinity that it should be otherwise but right now it is what it is.

Well, if you open the example that I attached on the first post, you can see that the global colours can survive without a document palette! Check out the big triangle thingy, it has the colour "Globale Farbe 18". The same colour is used on the small triangle on the bottom right. You can "Edit global colour" and change both of them at the same time!

I agree that this may be not intended by Affinity, it may well be a bug of some sort. 

[walt.farrell]

4 minutes ago, k_au said:

I think importing a .afpalette before starting a new document will probably be what I'll do.

You need to do it after creating the document, and you need to import it as a Document Palette.

5 minutes ago, k_au said:

Yes, thats a bummer. Maybe exporting a new .afpalette and importing into an existing file might work? 

I don't think that will work as you want.

[k_au]

1 minute ago, walt.farrell said:

You need to do it after creating the document, and you need to import it as a Document Palette.

Yes of course. But before I start working in the document, to save me from future frustration.

Quote

I don't think that will work as you want.

That's highly likely 🤣

[thomaso]

@k_au, it is a known issue and a limitation "by design" in Affinity that "global" colour swatches don't work as expected because the understanding of the term "global" appears to vary. It was discussed quite a few times since years … for instance

[k_au]

Thanks @thomaso, it's kind of depressing to read all of this...

In a way, objects do have the global colour attached as an attribute that travels with them, as the example file above shows. But it really is not much use as long as no swatch travels with them.