Photo 2 stops painting -Bug?

[lphilpot]

Photo 2.2.1.2075 on Windows 11

I've seen this happen more than once before but usually restarting Photo "fixes" it. Not so far this time.

I've added an adjustment / filter layer and then added an empty mask. I use a white brush to selectively paint in where I want the effect. Nothing unusual about that.

But for some reason it won't paint on the mask. One time (out of many attempts) I got it to paint a single stroke across the actual pixel layer, but that's been it so far -- Since this started happening, that is. Earlier I used the very same technique on several other occasions without issue (on the same document).

Relevant points:

• Brush is active, partially opaque (i.e., visible), flow is OK, etc. All normal, same settings as before when it worked
• Paint color is white, mask is black
• Layer transparency is 100%
• I even tried turning off all layers above the one in question just in case something was obscuring it, but no change
• Paint strokes are registered in the undo stack but never show up visually, whether on the mask in direct edit or as the effect on the image itself

You can see in this desktop video what's happening (don't laugh at the horrible-light image, fortunately it's beside the point):

 

Known bug? User error?

Thanks.

[walt.farrell]

You might try turning off Protect Alpha in the Context Toolbar.

[lphilpot]

4 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

You might try turning off Protect Alpha in the Context Toolbar.

Interesting.... It was off initially (never been enabled) when the problem started. I turned it on during troubleshooting and forgot to turn it back off again. But when I disabled it just now it started working again. Maybe something got reset by turning it on and back off again.... who knows.

But also there was this:

So, in order:

1. Painting stopped working
2. Protect Alpha was enabled, along with many other testing ops
3. Photo was restarted and the document reloaded
4. I saw the unusual diagonal red line on the mask (above)
5. I deleted and recreated the mask
6. Painting still didn't work
7. Disabled Protect Alpha
8. Painting now works again

So I'm not sure what happened, but it still smells at least faintly of bug...

[Dan C]

Hi @lphilpot,

14 hours ago, lphilpot said:

• I saw the unusual diagonal red line on the mask (above)

This line indicates the mask is 'Hidden', when collapsed in the Layers Studio:

14 hours ago, lphilpot said:

• Disabled Protect Alpha
• Painting now works again

With Protect Alpha enabled, you would not see any reaction of the Paint Brush Tool on the Mask layer, and this is expected behaviour.

From the information provided above, I don't detect any bug with the app currently - but if you continue to see unexpected issues then please don't hesitate to let us know 

[lphilpot]

20 minutes ago, Dan C said:

With Protect Alpha enabled, you would not see any reaction of the Paint Brush Tool on the Mask layer, and this is expected behaviour.

Understood, but I couldn't see anything before I enabled it... Also I didn't see any painting results on the pixel layer except for one isolated stroke.

[Dan C]

2 hours ago, lphilpot said:

Understood, but I couldn't see anything before I enabled it... Also I didn't see any painting results on the pixel layer except for one isolated stroke.

Are you able to provide a screen recording of this behaviour? As it doesn't seem to be covered in the previous recording above and everything is working as expected for me currently.

If your mask was hidden (ie the red 'line' was showing across the thumbnail), then painting with the Paint Brush would not show any effect, with or without Protect Alpha enabled.

[lphilpot]

1 minute ago, Dan C said:

Are you able to provide a screen recording of this behaviour? As it doesn't seem to be covered in the previous recording above and everything is working as expected for me currently.

Well, it's working now.... of course. 🙂 But I'll try to capture it if / when it happens again. But actually I think (?) it is shown in the video above. I Alt+click to show the mask (for clarity, since it's a mask on a High Pass layer and wouldn't be visible on a video at this low zoom level) and then paint on the mask. You can see the paint strokes being added to the history stack, yet they're not visible on the mask as grey / white areas. Is there something else you need to see?

2 minutes ago, Dan C said:

If your mask was hidden (ie the red 'line' was showing across the thumbnail)

For whatever reason that apparently was the first time I've seen a hidden mask in a collapsed layer state (I typically have no need to hide a mask). But I can assure you it wasn't hidden when I was trying to paint. At any rate, as above I'll try to provide more info if it happens again.

[Dan C]

Just now, lphilpot said:

I Alt+click to show the mask (for clarity, since it's a mask on a High Pass layer and wouldn't be visible on a video at this low zoom level) and then paint on the mask. You can see the paint strokes being added to the history stack, yet they're not visible on the mask as grey / white areas. Is there something else you need to see?

Throughout the video, Protect Alpha is enabled for the Paint Brush tool - hence you see no change to the Mask layer. This does not however stop the app from creating History steps for each stroke painted, regardless of if the stroke can be seen on the mask itself.

2 minutes ago, lphilpot said:

I'll try to capture it if / when it happens again (...)
For whatever reason that apparently was the first time I've seen a hidden mask in a collapsed layer state (I typically have no need to hide a mask). But I can assure you it wasn't hidden when I was trying to paint. At any rate, as above I'll try to provide more info if it happens again.

Thanks for letting me know, I certainly understand and we're happy to help, should any further issues occur

[lphilpot]

21 minutes ago, Dan C said:

Throughout the video, Protect Alpha is enabled for the Paint Brush tool - hence you see no change to the Mask layer. This does not however stop the app from creating History steps for each stroke painted, regardless of if the stroke can be seen on the mask itself.

You're right about that, but as I told Walt upthread I turned on Protect Alpha only later in the troubleshooting process, as a test. When it started failing to paint earlier, Protect Alpha was disabled. But once again until it happens again I can't say for sure.

Thanks.

[lphilpot]

On 11/17/2023 at 8:54 AM, Dan C said:

Thanks for letting me know, I certainly understand and we're happy to help, should any further issues occur

OK, it happened again basically like yesterday. It worked fine for 30 minutes or so editing then just stopped painting. In this video you can see where there's another mask (higher in the layer stack) that shows on the thumbnail it was edited, but not this one. The brush is selected, white paint, good opacity, etc. (all the same settings that worked before). Protect Alpha is turned off (I toggled it just to test, but no cigar). It just won't paint. The mask is selected, as evidenced by the greyscale palette. Nothing shows up on the mask nor its thumbnail.

 

Thanks.

[lphilpot]

Something I just noticed, although I don't know if it makes any difference. On the "non-painting" mask, there's a brush icon whereas on the "painting" mask there isn't. This was also true yesterday. I did nothing different procedurally between the two masks, though.

[lphilpot]

I think I see what it is - The opacity is getting set to zero. I've not changed it, but in the video above you can see it's zero. I'll have to keep on working and see if it happens again.

[walt.farrell]

54 minutes ago, lphilpot said:

The opacity is getting set to zero. I've not changed it, but in the video above you can see it's zero.

That may mean you pressed the 0 (zero) key at some point.

[lphilpot]

Always possible but both zero keys are a long way from anything I generally press. Except for Ctrl+0 ... maybe.

[thomaso]

4 hours ago, lphilpot said:

The opacity is getting set to zero. I've not changed it,

I experience this in V1 quite often without being able yet to detect the culprit. Oddly/interestingly it happens only with White + Mask layers.

[lphilpot]

8 minutes ago, thomaso said:

it happens only with White + Mask layers

Yep, exactly.

[thomaso]

It seems to be related to an 'automatic' switch in the Colours Panel not working reliable: Selecting a mask layer sometimes makes it switch to Grayscale (as expected) but if I press X (to toggle background/foreground colour) then it may switch to CMYK or RGB, independent of the document's colour space (while I would expect it to remain in grayscale). That means this issue with 0% opacity white can occur in the Colour Panel modes Grayscale, RGB and CMYK. 

Right now it happens reproducible / without any layer:
I create a new sRGB document –> it opens the Colours Panel with foreground White / background None Ø  –> still with an empty Layers panel I switch from Move Tool to Paint Brush Tool –> now the background colour well jumps to front + switches to white appearance with 0 % opacity –> moving the slider to 100% results in gray (RGB 128) –> creating a mask layer with option key (I'd expect black) switches to grayscale 43%.

[lphilpot]

45 minutes ago, thomaso said:

It seems to be related to an 'automatic' switch in the Colours Panel not working reliable: Selecting a mask layer sometimes makes it switch to Grayscale (as expected) but if I press X (to toggle background/foreground colour)

That's quite often my sequence: B, D, X

[lphilpot]

2 hours ago, thomaso said:

Right now it happens reproducible / without any layer:
I create a new sRGB document –> it opens the Colours Panel with foreground White / background None Ø  –> still with an empty Layers panel I switch from Move Tool to Paint Brush Tool –> now the background colour well jumps to front + switches to white appearance with 0 % opacity –> moving the slider to 100% results in gray (RGB 128) –> creating a mask layer with option key (I'd expect black) switches to grayscale 43%.

FWIW, in 2.2.1:

1. Create an sRGB document with transparent background
   Hand tool is selected
   Color wheel shows white FG and black BG, 100% opacity
2. Select Brush tool
   Color wheel shows black FG and white BG, 100% opacity (i.e., swapped FG/BG)
3. Slider appears to work correctly

[TrUzApalOOza]

I have this problem multiple times a week on my Windows 2.3.1.   I have confirmed blend mode normal, wet edges off, protect alpha off.     Add mask to new layer, can not paint on mask layer no effect.   It does look like the erase brush works when it is wonky.   Toggling layers enabled/disabled no change.  disabling lower layers no change.  Sometimes if I restart AF it goes back to working.  I had on earlier this week refused even after saving, and restarting.  I finally just gave up created a new document, started with the layer I wanted to mask made sure it was working, then pulled all my other layers back end from bad document and replaced it.

I'll have to try a video capture next time, and will see if any tricks from this topic are helpful.  Otherwise I am open to any other hints.

[thomaso]

14 minutes ago, TrUzApalOOza said:

 I have confirmed blend mode normal, wet edges off, protect alpha off. 

(…) will see if any tricks from this topic are helpful

Colour opacity?

[TrUzApalOOza]

I did check opacity, flow and hardness for the brushes selected (tried numerous) when trying to paint on the mask layer.   Next time this occurs, I will run back thru this thread for each item.