Magnification defaults?

[Thorworx]

If I open a 1024x1024px image in AP, it opens at 60.5%.

Why?

 

I don't see any place to set default magnification in prefs, in fact, when opening files in AP, it seems completely random as far as what magnification you get.

I just opened a 539x766px image, it opened at 80.9%

 

For EVERY file that I open, I have to double click the magnifying glass to zoom to 100%, and then adjust the window size to see the whole image.

This can't be the intended behaviour, can it?

 

My monitor resolution is 2560x1440, so there is plenty of room on the screen for a 1024x1024 image at 100%.

 

It seems to me that if an image will fit on the screen it should open at 100%, not some random percentage.

 

Thanks for any help on this

 

EDIT: After posting this, I was checking out the View menu and clicked on "Actual size". It zoomed to 151.4%

Where does this number come from?

[DWright]

Hi Thorworx,

 

When AP opens an image it defaults to the zoom to fit display option which is why the zoom level varies between different photos, you can quickly goto 100% view by pressing cmd + 1.

 

The actual size will change the view to the photo's dimensions.

 

You can change the AP window mode to full screen and you image will fully fit into your screen resolution.

[R C-R]

Aside from the cmd plus a number shortcuts to go to the preset zoom levels, you can quickly zoom to any level with the spacebar plus cmd or cmd & alt toggles (but you have to remember the quirk in Affinity that the spacebar must be pressed first for this to work) & that you can zoom with the scroll wheel if that is enabled or with pinch gestures on a trackpad.

 

Since zooming in & out for retouching & such is so frequently needed, I think it is useful to get familiar with all the zoom options available.

[Thorworx]

Hi Thorworx,

 

When AP opens an image it defaults to the zoom to fit display option which is why the zoom level varies between different photos, you can quickly goto 100% view by pressing cmd + 1.

 

The actual size will change the view to the photo's dimensions.

 

You can change the AP window mode to full screen and you image will fully fit into your screen resolution.

 

DWright, thanks for the reply... but I still would like to know what's going on.

 

"zoom to fit display"

 

But it is NOT zooming to fit my display.  How does it determine this?

 

First photo = Opened a file with AP

 

As you can see, my display is plenty large enough. What is AP using to zoom to?

 

2nd photo = same file at 100% magnification.

 

3rd photo = another opened file. Opened at 99%. Plenty of screen to open at 100%

 

As I said, my resolution is 2560x1440. If it's going to "zoom to display", why isn't it using the available screen real estate?

In my opinion ALL images should open at 100% unless it is larger than the display area. That is how I interpret "zoom to display".

 

 

 

 

The actual size will change the view to the photo's dimensions.

 

You can change the AP window mode to full screen and you image will fully fit into your screen resolution.

 

 

As I said above, clicking "Actual size" zoomed an image to 151.4%, NOT the image's actual dimensions.

 

As Gear maker says below, this definitely appears to be a bug/problem with separated mode. I would expect the same behaviour in either mode.

Hopefully this can be addressed in an update.

 

EDIT: I just switched to full screen, and unified mode, and "Actual Size" still zooms to an arbitrary percentage, NOT the pixel dimensions.

[Gear maker]

But Thorworx was asking when it first opens the image why it opens to the odd size.  I have been wondering this same issue also and that answer from DWright "When AP opens an image it defaults to the zoom to fit display option which is why the zoom level varies between different photos" doesn't explain it to me, maybe I'm just being dense.  If the image is 1024 x 1024 and the monitor is 2560 x 1440, shouldn't it open to at least 100%?

 

FYI I'm in Separated Mode, not sure if Thorworx is also.

[Thorworx]

Aside from the cmd plus a number shortcuts to go to the preset zoom levels, you can quickly zoom to any level with the spacebar plus cmd or cmd & alt toggles (but you have to remember the quirk in Affinity that the spacebar must be pressed first for this to work) & that you can zoom with the scroll wheel if that is enabled or with pinch gestures on a trackpad.

 

Since zooming in & out for retouching & such is so frequently needed, I think it is useful to get familiar with all the zoom options available.

 

R-C-R,

 

Thanks for your reply.

 

I am well aware of all of the zoom methods as well as the shortcuts. After 25 years of using PhotoShop, and using space, command and option for zooming Affinity's "quirk" of "spacebar first" really slows me down. My muscle memory just wants to "chord" the keys -- and Affinity just doesn't like that.

 

But beyond that, my issue here is that I should be able to open a file and work on it without having to zoom it first.

[Thorworx]

But Thorworx was asking when it first opens the image why it opens to the odd size.  I have been wondering this same issue also and that answer from DWright "When AP opens an image it defaults to the zoom to fit display option which is why the zoom level varies between different photos" doesn't explain it to me, maybe I'm just being dense.  If the image is 1024 x 1024 and the monitor is 2560 x 1440, shouldn't it open to at least 100%?

 

FYI I'm in Separated Mode, not sure if Thorworx is also.

 

 

Yes I only use separated mode, and I have no use for tabs in a photo editor or design app, or full screen apps either. ;)

[R C-R]

To try to reduce a little of the confusion about this, consider that the command is not "zoom to fit the display" but in separated mode to zoom to fit in the window the document is displayed in (& that that mode is often used to display more than one document). Also, as is customary in many apps, there is a small amount of space in the window reserved for an outside-the-document border so users can quickly click in that area to deselect everything. The border will usually be larger in one dimension because the ratio of the document's dimensions to the window's dimensions is not usually the same.

 

In the unified workspace (non-separated) view similar considerations apply -- the canvas is only a variable sized part of the display (in part because the Studio panel can be expanded or contracted horizontally & because the UI can be toggled on & off to hide all panels & toolbars) so the command isn't "zoom to fit the display" for it either.

 

For all view modes, the canvas can be set to be larger or smaller than the photo layer(s) so from what I can tell "zoom to fit" basically means "zoom to fit the canvas" (or "zoom to fit the Artboard space" when the workspace contains Artboards). 

[Thorworx]

Thanks for your reply R C-R

 

To try to reduce a little of the confusion about this, consider that the command is not "zoom to fit the display" but in separated mode to zoom to fit in the window the document is displayed in (& that that mode is often used to display more than one document). Also, as is customary in many apps, there is a small amount of space in the window reserved for an outside-the-document border so users can quickly click in that area to deselect everything. The border will usually be larger in one dimension because the ratio of the document's dimensions to the window's dimensions is not usually the same.

 

 

Apologies, I misread DWright's comment:

 

When AP opens an image it defaults to the zoom to fit display option which is why the zoom level varies between different photos, you can quickly goto 100% view by pressing cmd + 1.

 

 

I read: "zoom to fit display option"

... instead of "zoom to fit display option"

 

Okay, I now understand that is what it's doing... However, the images I show above were on fresh launches of AP with no windows open. Therefore, AP is somehow deciding what size to create the initial window/canvas, and then fitting any opened image inside it that size -- on my machine this appears to be 1000x720. The question is still: Why? Where does 1000x720 come from?

 

Any image opened should initially display at 100% by default regardless of the size of any windows open, the size of your workspace, etc. (unless it won't fit on your screen - in which case it should be scaled down to fit). Does this not make sense? I can't think of any other graphics program that does NOT show opened files at 100%. Even Preview.app does this. And btw, I think AD should do this, too. On my monitor in AD, I can view an 8.5x11in artboard at 100% without scrolling. AD doesn't seem to want to open files that way either, though. It doesn't even remember the zoom saved state. 1000x720px window with 8.5x11 zoomed to 51.7%

 

Another issue that adds to the frustration is that there is no option to "snap canvas to content". This would be very helpful with the current behaviour because at least after I manually zoom to 100%, I'd be able to view my entire image without having to manually resize the workspace to fit. This used to be the default behaviour of window on the Mac using the resize widget in the toolbars. I miss this. Now that widget is used for going fullscreen, (and with option key, zooming the canvas OUT to screen extants), but not back to content.

 

I can see no advantage to opening images at arbitrary zoom levels based on an arbitrary (1000x720?) generated canvas size, and many advantages to opening images at 100% whenever possible.

 

Basically, I'd like to be able to zoom the viewport to the image size, not zoom the image to the viewport size.

[JimmyJack]

I have no answer for the initial zoom state. Personally, when I open an image I like to see the whole image. No matter what the size, I want to see it all to get my bearings. Then I zoom in from there. Perhaps there should be an settable option....

That still doesn't explain though, that if you have enough screen real estate why it's not opening to actual pixel size. 

 

That being said :)

 

"snap canvas to content"

 

Can you use: Document drop down > Clip Canvas?

[Thorworx]

"snap canvas to content"

 

Can you use: Document drop down > Clip Canvas?

 

 

Thanks for posting JimmyJack

 

Sorry, I wasn't really clear... I wasn't talking about the actual canvas or clipping content - I meant the window/viewport itself.

 

Continuing on my example: In separated mode, when I open any image, the window is 1000x720px (this seems to be the "default" size for all new windows in AP and AD)

Let's say I want to view the image at 100%

If I zoom (using whatever method) if the image is larger than the window size (like if my image is 1024x1024), now I can't see the whole image area, so I then have to manually resize the window to greater than 1024x1024 and/or pan the image into view.

 

In the old days, the Mac toolbar min/max widget shrank the window to display just the content, system wide and in all apps. If the window was smaller than the content, it would grow to the content boundaries with just a click. At some point Apple changed the widget to be used for fullscreen instead. Currently in AP, I can option-click the fullscreen widget but that just maximizes the window/viewport, it doesn't wrap the viewport to the canvas/content.

 

So I end up spending a lot of time fussing with window re-sizing instead of just getting work done.

 

I may have MANY images open on my screen at once which I need to compare, or copy/paste between.

[R C-R]

Like JimmyJack & I suspect most users, I want to see all of the image when I first open a document. I also almost never work with documents small enough to fit on screen at 100%. I suspect this is true for many if not most users. After all, even most point & shoot cameras & smartphones take photos upwards of 3000 pixels on the long dimension, as are A4 or U.S. letter sized pages. Images destined for the web typically are much smaller, but it is not unusual to work with much larger 'native' documents & only export to a web-friendly size later on.

 

I am using a 27" iMac with a 2560x1440 pixel display, & I know a lot of Affinity users are using Macs with smaller screens. I think this has a lot to do with why 100% is not the default zoom level -- in a very real sense, "Zoom to Fit" is the only practical "one size fits all" default zoom level.

 

Of course, this doesn't explain why in separated mode document windows don't by default open to fill the available screen space. I said "available screen space" because depending on the layout of tool, toolbar, & Studio & other palette windows (which all have variable sizes & positions), that won't be the same for everyone. I think that is part of the explanation for this default behavior: consider that some users won't want the document window to extend behind any of those UI elements, while that is exactly what others do want. So this is yet another thing where "one size fits all" will not apply.

 

Another part of the explanation is probably something Thorworx touched on: it is not unusual to have multiple document windows open, & a major reason for using separated view to begin with seems to be able to see more than one of them at once, something that can't be done in the unified workspace (non-separated) view. Also, this isn't confined to different documents -- don't forget Affinity can display multiple views of the same document, each in its own window. There isn't much point in that unless the windows can be displayed so that at least part of each of them is visible at the same time.

 

There are other things to consider that complicate this even more, like that some users use multiple monitors and/or multiple OS X "spaces," & that the different supported  OS X versions (10.7 through 10.11 currently) treat these things slightly differently. Whatever we would like to see as the default or preference-settable options would have to take all that into account. Personally, I have no idea how this could be done without making it a nightmare for users & programmers alike -- for example, imagine upgrading the OS only to learn that your preferences or whatever don't apply anymore.

 

Please don't get me wrong. I definitely think there are improvements that can & should be made to the window/workspace/zoom/default UI stuff. My point here is just that there are no straightforward, obvious ways to do it that will make everybody happy.

[JimmyJack]

R C-R, I hear what you're saying. The initial zoom thing is a can or worms perhaps.

However... upon reading Thorworx's (that's hard to say ...  :D ) clarification, there's another issue here which, it seems, can be addressed.

 

His issue is (I think ;) ) that if he resizes his image to be either smaller or larger than his separated workspace window, there is no option to tell the window itself to expand or contract to fit the artwork size.

 

This can be done in Preview for example. Shrink or expand an image within or beyond its frame and hit Window > Zoom and bang the window frame matches the image size (well, Preview has minimum dimensions it won't go smaller than. So does AP but those limits are much smaller... something like 240x140 px). You can do this on a per window/image basis so multiple files isn't a problem as well. 

[R C-R]

This can be done in Preview for example. Shrink or expand an image within or beyond its frame and hit Window > Zoom and bang the window frame matches the image size ...

For me that isn't exactly what happens. Depending on the image size, the amount it is zoomed before hitting Window > Zoom, & the current window size, the window may resize to (according to the View menu checkmark) "Actual size" or to "Zoom to Fit." This happens even when the actual size of the image is small enough to easily fit on the screen, & often the two window sizes are considerably different. Also, when the image is considerably larger than would fit on the screen, when I first open it the window is large & the image is zoomed to fit, but the window does not use all of the available screen space -- there are still unfilled margins to the right & bottom of the window of variable size. Hitting Window > Zoom in this case resizes the window to eliminate the borders & fills all the available space, but it leaves empty margins inside the window on the left & right sides.

 

Preview's preferences also allows users to define "100% scale" two different ways, one with an image pixel equal to a screen pixel & the other with the screen size equal to the printout size, & to define that separately for PDF's & for everything else. In other words, even actual size & 100% size are variable, depending on if they are references to screen or printed output sizes.

 

Apple has changed how all this works several times with different releases of the app & OS. As a former long time frequent contributor to Apple's user forums, I am all too well aware that every change has pleased some users & outraged others. I believe the same thing will happen no matter what Affinity changes -- some users will love them & others will think they are the stupidest, most illogical things they could have done.

[Thorworx]

Like JimmyJack & I suspect most users, I want to see all of the image when I first open a document. I also almost never work with documents small enough to fit on screen at 100%. I suspect this is true for many if not most users. After all, even most point & shoot cameras & smartphones take photos upwards of 3000 pixels on the long dimension, as are A4 or U.S. letter sized pages. Images destined for the web typically are much smaller, but it is not unusual to work with much larger 'native' documents & only export to a web-friendly size later on.

 

 

All true. However, I'm a web developer, and when preparing images my final images destined for web will fit on my 27" monitor at 100%. The behavior that I've mentioned several times in this thread would address the issue of larger original files:

 

Any image opened should initially display at 100% by default regardless of the size of any windows open, the size of your workspace, etc. (unless it won't fit on your screen - in which case it should be scaled down to fit).

 

This would, in effect, maintain the current behavior for everyone, and still be a sensible approach (like Preview, etc) with regard to the initial display of 100% images for me.

[R C-R]

For separated mode, as an alternative to the current default behavior I would not object to a preference to instead open documents at 100% where possible, but I would be very unhappy if it was an unchangeable default behavior.

 

That is because I use separated mode primarily to work on multiple documents and/or multiple views arranged all over the screen (& sometimes on a second monitor), along with various "docked" & "undocked" Studio & other panels. So unless they are all small documents (& for me they almost never are) it would be very annoying to have to reduce the size of every newly opened window so that everything would fit without obscuring the others, & more annoying still if they just opened in some area where there currently is no other document window at whatever size that area allows (which would constantly be decreasing in size as more of the screen space was used).

 

The current behavior isn't perfect for this kind of workflow either, but at least it is consistent & because it cascades newly opened windows it (usually) makes it relatively easy to select whichever one I want to move to some other screen position without having to move others out of the way. If anything, I would prefer that in separated mode every newly opened document opened in a considerably smaller window than it does now.

 

This is what I meant about not being able to please everyone. What I would like is essentially the opposite of what you want, & I'm sure there are others who would want something different from either of us.

[Pierrott]

I'm a total newbie.

But here's something weird. 

I have about 6 "Views" open. 

I'm watching the Navigation Tab bottom left.

I set my first "view" (or window) to [Actual Size] from the [View] menu. It shows 103% in the Navigator bottom left.

Then I set the second "View" to [Atual Size]from the [View] menu. It shows 16% in the Navigator bottom left. 

Then I set the third "View" to [Atual Size]from the [View] menu. It shows 16% in the Navigator bottom left. 

Then I set the fourth "View" to [Atual Size]from the [View] menu. It shows 17% in the Navigator bottom left. 

Then I set the fifth "View" to [Atual Size]from the [View] menu. It shows 17% in the Navigator bottom left. 

Then I set the sixth "View" to [Atual Size]from the [View] menu. It shows 103% in the Navigator bottom left. 

They ALL LOOK the same size.

I see that the file sizes of my screenshots differ... curiouser and curiouser...

What am I missing?

Thanks

Pierre