Yu fonts compatibility between Mac & Windows

[ashf]

Affinity does not recognize Yu fonts as the same font between Mac & Windows. they are a systems font on both platforms.
This may not be exactly a bug, but MS Office & LibreOffice consider them as the same font.

Yu Gothic(Winodws)
YuGothic(Mac)

Yu Mincho(Winodws)
YuMincho(Mac)

[kenmcd]

Apple appears to have changed the name to delete the space when they added it to macOS.
They are listed on the Fonts Included with Ventura page without the space.

Apple and advanced applications such as Affinity use the Typographic Family name (Name16).
Since these are different on each OS they are properly seen as two different font families.

Word and LibreOffice use the style group / Family Name (Name 1).
These should be consistent with how Name 16 is configured.
Given Apple's history of sabotaging the style groups it would not be a surprise if they left this field with the space - which could create a name conflict.

I doubt this is an Affinity issue.
But I do not have the Ventura fonts to check them for sure.

 

[ashf]

This is not Ventura only problem.
I  was aware of it since long time ago, but just noticed that MSO and LO handle it.

[walt.farrell]

9 hours ago, ashf said:

This is not Ventura only problem.
I  was aware of it since long time ago, but just noticed that MSO and LO handle it.

Perhaps you could provide the Ventura fonts to @kenmcd to allow further analysis? (And if so, it might be better done via DM, and via a cloud service or email, instead of posting them here.)

[Pyanepsion]

3 hours ago, walt.farrell said:

Perhaps you could provide the Ventura fonts to @kenmcd to allow further analysis?

Attention: it is necessary that the user has the right to do so. This is not always the case. Very often, only an extract of the collection is provided free of charge and with various authorisations.

On Windows, Yu Gothic and Yu Mincho are excerpts provided free of charge for Windows users.

According to the reference software MainType from the company High-Logic:

On Windows, Yu Gothic is a True Type TTC collection that includes 9 fonts divided into the following 4 files:

1. YuGothL.ttc: Yu Gothic Light, Yu Gotghic UI Light;
2. YuGothR.ttc: Yu Gothic Regular, Yu Gothic UI Semilight;
3. YugothM.ttc: Yu Gothic Medium, Yu Gothic UI Regular;
4. YuGothB.ttc: Yu Gothic Bold, Yu Gothic UI Bold, Yu Gothic UI Semibold.

On Windows, Yu Mincho is a set of True Type TTF fonts that includes 3 fonts distributed in the following 3 files:

1. yuminl.ttf: Yu Mincho Light;
2. yumin.ttf: Yu Mincho Regular;
3. yumindb.ttf: Yu Mincho Demibold.

[kenmcd]

The Ventura versions may also be in TTC files. Do not have them so I do not know.

To check the name fields we need to extract the individual TTF files from the TTC.

I have already done this with the Windows versions. And they look fine.

[kenmcd]

13 hours ago, ashf said:

This is not Ventura only problem.
I  was aware of it since long time ago, but just noticed that MSO and LO handle it.

Looks like the fonts were added in Monterey. The fonts are in the online list.

And I have all the Big Sur fonts and they are not there.

[ashf]

6 hours ago, walt.farrell said:

Perhaps you could provide the Ventura fonts to @kenmcd to allow further analysis? (And if so, it might be better done via DM, and via a cloud service or email, instead of posting them here.)

YuGothic in Ventura and Monterey is the same.
It's a system font and the font version is the same also.

[kenmcd]

Got a look at the fonts from Ventura.
And they definitely have different family names (no space).
And as suspected the style groups are a complete mess.

If you can just use the Windows versions on both platforms.
They are properly configured for cross-platform use.
And properly configured for advanced applications like Affinity, and for applications which use the style-linking like Word and LibreOffice.
The family names are different so the you could even have them both installed.

 

[Pyanepsion]

3 hours ago, kenmcd said:

The family names are different so the you could even have them both installed.

The Maintype software mentioned above will be able to flag and remove duplicate font families and fonts.

[kenmcd]

16 hours ago, Pyanepsion said:

The Maintype software mentioned above will be able to flag and remove duplicate font families and fonts.

MainType is for Windows only - and the fonts you would want to get rid of are the Mac versions.

[walt.farrell]

@ashf: the easiest approach may be to Package the file and transfer the complete Package to the other system. When you Open the Package (.afpackage) file the fonts in the Package will be temporarily installed for use in Publisher, ensuring the same fonts are used for that project on both systems.

[ashf]

14 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

@ashf: the easiest approach may be to Package the file and transfer the complete Package to the other system. When you Open the Package (.afpackage) file the fonts in the Package will be temporarily installed for use in Publisher, ensuring the same fonts are used for that project on both systems.

Right. but this is a suggestion from normal people's expectation like in MS Office.
I saw people confused by using them like the Times New Roman font which is universal on both platforms.

[walt.farrell]

1 hour ago, ashf said:

I saw people confused by using them like the Times New Roman font which is universal on both platforms.

But even if the font exists on both systems, and has the same name so it's recognized, it can have different characteristics (kerning, letter heights, and various others) that can throw off the layout. We've seen that before, I think, with fonts that Windows and Mac have in "common".

If you're sharing with sharing with someone else, Packaging prevents problems.

[kenmcd]

1 hour ago, walt.farrell said:

We've seen that before, I think, with fonts that Windows and Mac have in "common".

There are a few where the vertical metrics settings are different on the Mac version vs. the Windows version (IIRC - Calibri, Palatino, etc.). The work-around is to set a fixed leading.

In this case with these fonts - the Mac fonts are not going to work properly on a Windows system, so a package going from Mac to Windows is going to have problems