Lazy Nezumi Pro: One more reason I'm eagerly awaiting the .MSI install version.

[Grant Robertson]

Even though I really like the Affinity suite of programs, I had been sticking with an old version of AutoDesk Sketchbook for doing my sketches, because it has nice perspective drawing guides, that allow me to A) Import a photo of a room or building, B) Insert perspective guides and align them with the actual lines in the photo, then C) Easily sketch out a project that I want to build, over that photo. 

Before V2 came out, I hadn't really been thinking of the Affinity programs as effective tools to do rough sketching. When Krita 5.x came out, I took a look and discovered that they had even better perspective guides than AutoDesk Sketchbook. And so, I began working on learning Krita, with the intention to use it for all sketching and painting work. I figured, I would reserve the Affinity programs for use when I needed a more "finished look." Of course, this meant that I would have to learn two very different user interfaces and "modus operandi."

As I have said elsewhere, when the V2 versions of the Affinity programs came out, I immediately "upgraded," even though I knew they did not have perspective guides at all. I did this because I knew I would still want to use those programs for that "finished look," and I knew there would likely be at least three years worth of upgrades forthcoming. (All the videos and tutorials about "perspective guides" were merely about drawing some lines on a transparent-ish top layer and simply following them with your eye. Personally, I found that to be an absolutely lame workaround, and it really exposed which YouTubers were willing to repeat nonsense just to generate content.)

And then I happened to notice someone mention this "helper utility" called, Lazy Nezumi Pro, in a YouTube video, almost as an aside. It promised to fill in all the blanks of the "missing" drawing guides in the Affinity programs, and more. I did some research, and saw that it didn't work with Affinity programs at first but, upon request, they adapted it to work with the V1 apps. Unfortunately, while doing said research I found a mention that Lazy Nezumi Pro will not work with programs that are "sandboxed," and my heart just sunk. Here, I had thought I had figured out a way to focus all of my energies on learning only one suite of programs.

I wrote the makers of Lazy Nezumi Pro, and they tell me that, indeed, their app will not work with any programs that are "sandboxed," as the V2 programs are. 

So, I know this will not make the developers work any faster. But I do hope this helps impress upon the executives in the company that there is more to be gained from getting that .MSI installer out, than simply being able to launch Affinity Photo from within various photo managers. Who knows how many add-ons and/or plug-ins do not work simply because the Affinity programs are not installed like a regular program. Who knows how much additional functionality Affinity users are forced to give up (besides what comes in the "box"), and where their threshold will be for choosing to simply use a different program. As it is, I still have to use Krita for my original sketches. The more time I spend learning Krita, the less time I have to learn Affinity programs. And, the more likely I will be to just recommend Krita to someone, rather than Affinity, just because I know it better. Something tells me that is not the outcome you desire.

Thank you for coming to my TED Talk.

 

Edit: I was hoping I would have to add this but: Please only stick to the question at hand. I am not asking how to be a better artist. And I am certainly not asking how to be an artist exactly like you. And to be even more clear, "perspective guides" are not stabilizers.

Edited December 11, 2022 by Grant Robertson

[rvst]

On 12/9/2022 at 2:07 AM, Grant Robertson said:

Who knows how many add-ons and/or plug-ins do not work simply because the Affinity programs are not installed like a regular program. Who knows how much additional functionality Affinity users are forced to give up (besides what comes in the "box"), and where their threshold will be for choosing to simply use a different program.

I have wondered several times what was going through the Affinity devs heads when they made the decision to move to the UWP architecture. That there would be these interoperability issues with external editors should have been glaringly obvious given that the entire design ethos of a UWP app is to isolate it from other apps and from the system. It's almost like someone made a spur-of-the-moment call without stopping to consider how users actually use Affinity products in their workflow. 

[debraspicher]

Wow. I remember the Lazy Nezumi hack for back when people used it to reduce shakey lines from crappy drivers back in the day. (There was no Pro)

I use Clip Studio for almost all my illustrative/painterly work. Don't let the furor about the subscription for updates inbetween upgrades discourage you. The program is pretty much complete as it is and spoils us with all the guides and features an illustrator can dream of. It is on sale for $30 I believe and includes the 2.0 update.

My question, why force any workflow to fit within the paradigms of one program? I tried this with PS and it limited my creativity by confining me to one workflow. I really suggest to try all the plethora of options that are now available out there and stick to what gives you the most creative freedom and will grow you as an artist.

Also working with your tablet, if you are dependent on something like Lazy Nezumi to get smooth lines, you are limiting your ability to maximize the use of the tablet. Ex: Drawing from wrist instead of shoulder really impacts linework. *However* if the goal is to get crisp lines like what can be achieved with a straightedge in traditional, then I have to double down on my suggestion of Clip Studio. Do it. They give you total freedom when it comes to setting up guides, with crazy amounts of options, guides per layer that you can draw a straightedge anyway. The brush engine is unbeatable in my view and has the brush stability options built in and customizeable if you really really desire that clean feeling when sketching/inking.

[Medical Officer Bones]

I agree wholeheartedly with @debraspicher. Clip Studio's sketching and inking 'feel' are impressive.

My favourite two drawing and digital painting apps are Clip Studio and Krita. I like Krita better for digital painting work and comic colouring personally.

And @debraspicher is on the ball when she mentions that if you have to rely on a stabilizer as a crutch (built-in or Lazy Nezumi) to draw smooth strokes, you are doing yourself a disfavour as an artist. It doesn't help with growing technically, but stabilizers often also introduce a certain identifiable look and feel in a drawing. At least that is my opinion.

Personally I always turn off stabilizers unless to create a certain look.

Obviously if the artist experiences physical issues (like hand tremors) a stabilizer can be a real life-saver.

[debraspicher]

Yes, CSP's stabilizer is per brush. It can be a hidden setting or can be added for that brush in the panel to be adjusted on the fly. Which means we're not forfeiting all of our brushwork to some great algorithmic overseer. It can set it higher to make a super smooth computer-y brush or just turn it down/off and have the "native" experience. The brush system is crazy good and fine art apps have come a long way. I'm sure Krita is also good as well.

[Grant Robertson]

5 hours ago, rvst said:

 It's almost like someone made a spur-of-the-moment call without stopping to consider how users actually use Affinity products in their workflow. 

I seriously doubt that's the case. First, developers are rarely allowed to make these kinds of decisions. That usually happens at the executive level. Second, they have made their case clear multiple times, as to why they made this decision. .MSIX installs are far more likely to be successful, thus resulting in far fewer complaints from initial users.

I expect that whoever made this decision was unaware of all the ways that external programs make use of graphic arts type programs.

I simply wish that they had chosen to release both versions at the same time, the way many companies are doing these days. They could release one version that is sold on the Microsoft store, so everyone knows exactly what type of app they are getting, and make sure and tell everyone what the limitations are for that form of app. And then release a regular installation version that is downloadable from their website. 

[rvst]

28 minutes ago, Grant Robertson said:

I expect that whoever made this decision was unaware of all the ways that external programs make use of graphic arts type programs.

I rest my case. That's pretty much what I said.

And I read their justification. As a developer myself, it still feels half-baked, especially since a technical packaging decision like this would have been made by an engineering manager who should have been aware of the consequences. 

[lforbes]

Does anyone have the MSI links for V2?

I bought V1 last month only to have them discontinue it before fixing the icon size.

V2 has the fixed icons BUT I cannot install it as I don't use C:\ but I use D:\Program Files. My C:\ is too tiny and just has Windows stuff installed. Everything else gets installed in D:\Program Files but the MSIX doesn't seem to let me change the directory.

[rvst]

5 minutes ago, lforbes said:

Does anyone have the MSI links for V2?

I bought V1 last month only to have them discontinue it before fixing the icon size.

V2 has the fixed icons BUT I cannot install it as I don't use C:\ but I use D:\Program Files. My C:\ is too tiny and just has Windows stuff installed. Everything else gets installed in D:\Program Files but the MSIX doesn't seem to let me change the directory.

Not released yet unfortunately. Serif staff say they hope to release it before Christmas

[lforbes]

2 hours ago, rvst said:

Not released yet unfortunately. Serif staff say they hope to release it before Christmas

OK Thanks. I guess I have to wait until Christmas before I can install it. 

[rvst]

2 minutes ago, lforbes said:

OK Thanks. I guess I have to wait until Christmas before I can install it. 

It is possible to configure Windows to install all new UWP apps to a different location. This link has details on how to do it

https://www.windowscentral.com/how-install-apps-separate-drive-windows-10