is there a more intuitive way to rotate canvas?

[rorque]

1 hour ago, R C-R said:

Are you saying there is a way in Affinity to assign keyboard shortcuts for rotating the canvas by an arbitrary amount?

preferences->shortcuts->view->rotate left/right

[R C-R]

13 minutes ago, rorque said:

preferences->shortcuts->view->rotate left/right

That only rotates the view of the canvas, not the canvas itself; and as been mentioned, it only does that in fixed, 15° increments, not by some arbitrary amount.

[rorque]

13 minutes ago, R C-R said:

That only rotates the view of the canvas, not the canvas itself; and as been mentioned, it only does that in fixed, 15° increments, not by some arbitrary amount.

rotating every 15 degrees is much more convenient for me than what photoshop offers. As for the fact that it rotates it's "only" a view, not canvas itself, I can't imagine why someone would need to rotate the whole canvas physically, from a keyboard shortcut and by any angle. Usually rotating the workspace is needed when you're drawing something at an awkward angle and need to have a nice line, or see something on different angle. 

[ARTurek]

I will add something to this discussion.
Unfortunately, I have to agree with the author of the topic. I too find the Affinity package inconvenient to use in some ways and should learn from the competition.

On the one hand, there are people for whom the existing solutions are sufficient and see no reason to introduce changes. On the other hand, there are people like me who would like to work better, faster, more comfortably and are not afraid of change. Personally, I see no reason to discriminate against one or the other group. If there is such a need, then why not implement the appropriate function and give everyone the opportunity to choose.
Why should only people with touch tablets be privileged?
There is a smooth zooming and panning of the working area.
[Space]+[Ctrl]+(draw horizontally) = smooth zoom
[RPB]+(move pen) = move canvas
Why not do something similar with rotation?
My navigation suggestion.
[Space]+[Ctrl]+(draw horizontally) = smooth rotation right/left
[Space]+[Ctrl]+(draw vertically) = smooth zoom in/out
[RPB]+(move pen) = move canvas
 

[ARTurek]

After thinking about the subject, I come to the conclusion that my proposal of zooming and rotating under the same keys can cause problems when accidentally the image starts rotating instead of zooming and vice versa.

Here is my second suggestion
[Space]+(pen movement) = move the view freely
[Space]+[RightPenButton]+(Pen move vertically) = free view zoom
[Space]+[leftPenButton]+(horizontal pen movement) = freely rotate the view
[Space]+[Ctrl]+[RightPenButton]+(pen move vertically) = zoom in by predefined value in the tool
[Space]+[Ctrl]+[leftPenButton]+(horizontal pen movement) = rotate the view by a predefined value in the tool
[Space]+[Shift]+(Horizontal/Vertical pen movement) = Horizontal/Vertical view flip.

[ARTurek]

Or maybe such a proposal?
[Space]+[Touch Canvas] - (or other key combination)
Such a sequence would trigger the appropriate rotate tool.
At the point of touch, there would be a point with the horizon line, with respect to which the rotation would take place. Further movement around the point would rotate the view, and the tool would simultaneously display the rotation angle relative to the horizon. With [Ctrl] pressed, the rotation would take place by previously defined units.

Of course, these are only initial suggestions and require some thought and checking that they will not interfere with other functions.
It can also be one multi-tool that zooms, rotates, pans, etc.

[Stepaan]

11 hours ago, Asyrel said:

since the npc's in this discussion dont understand what a rotation tool should do i will link a video for you npc's to see what an actual rotation tool is suppose to do 


Photoshop Rotation
Clip Studio Rotation
Krita
Corel paint essentials 
sketchbook pro
GIMP Even the shittiest software has a rotate tool

I dont understand how this is rocket science for you guys, I'm turning off notifications. if this doesn't get you guys to understand what a rotation tool or keybind should do i truly have no hope for the human race. I am now turning off notifications if you don't get it by now please go do something more productive with your life...

A thousand thanks! Please, come back more often. We desperately need your help, knowledge, patience, willingness, and your beautiful spirit.

[loukash]

3 hours ago, ARTurek said:

why not implement the appropriate function and give everyone the opportunity to choose

Probably because Serif is a small team with limited resources (they are still hiring!). They have to set priorities, that's why we're still eagerly waiting for many other often requested features. And that's why many less essential functions may need to wait for a bit longer. That's just my "half-educated" guess…

[cgidesign]

For me mimicing the handling of a physical paper and pen with keyboard shortcuts in digital painting was something I never felt comfortable with (in any software). In the end I bought a remote controller device with physical nobs and rotating wheels. Now that I got used to it and the muscle memory catched up, I like painting a mask a lot more than before.

I only wish (and of course wrote feature requests long ago) Flow, Opacity and Hardness would get keyboard shortcuts. If I had to decide between "configurable degree value for canvas rotation" and "Flow, Opacity, Hardness" I would choose the latter ones. Maybe it is time to write the feature request again - this time for version 2 😉

Edited November 16, 2022 by cgidesign
added hardness

[ARTurek]

48 minutes ago, loukash said:

Probably because Serif is a small team with limited resources (they are still hiring!). They have to set priorities, that's why we're still eagerly waiting for many other often requested features. And that's why many less essential functions may need to wait for a bit longer. That's just my "half-educated" guess…

Let's hope the wow factor won't always be a priority. In my opinion, even the best tools are useless if they cannot be used in an easy and intuitive way.
You can compare it to a hammer without a handle. Not a big deal, but there is a difference. I would say the same about some seemingly unimportant features in various apps.

[loukash]

Hm. I wouldn't seriously compare the "rotate canvas" function to a missing handle of a hammer.
Heck, I, for one, was able to do design work with a Wacom tablet and without a "rotate canvas" function literally for decades. Even though I sometimes wished it were there.

(That said though, I still prefer to do my illustrations by hand on paper, with a 3B pencil and Jaxon oil pastels. I need to feel the greasy pastels on my fingertips!  It's part of the process that no software can emulate!)

[ARTurek]

1 hour ago, loukash said:

(That said though, I still prefer to do my illustrations by hand on paper, with a 3B pencil and Jaxon oil pastels. I need to feel the greasy pastels on my fingertips!  It's part of the process that no software can emulate!)

I agree 100% with your opinion. Unfortunately, I don't always have the opportunity to play in real life 😟

I can also rotate the tablet and already the rotate function is ready 😁 However, I don't do that because it's easier to rotate a sheet of paper than an entire easel.
I somehow manage with what is available in Affinity. I don't even think about returning the software due to the lack of this or that. I'm just expressing my opinion and presenting a need. I think it's worth talking about such things so that the creators of Affinity know the needs of users. If we don't write about it on the forum, how will they know what we need?
By the way, the whole Serif team is doing a great job and has my great appreciation.

[loukash]

7 hours ago, ARTurek said:

I think it's worth talking about such things so that the creators of Affinity know the needs of users

Of course, that's what the forum is here for.  

[CM0]

10 hours ago, loukash said:

Probably because Serif is a small team with limited resources (they are still hiring!). They have to set priorities, that's why we're still eagerly waiting for many other often requested features. And that's why many less essential functions may need to wait for a bit longer. That's just my "half-educated" guess…

True, although this seems it would potentially fit in the very low hanging fruit category.  Easy to implement and provides nice user satisfaction.

[Grant Robertson]

Not being able to rotate the canvas with just two fingers on my touch screen means I will never use any of these programs (V2) for sketching or painting. (Two-finger zoom works just fine, though.) I guess I'll have to stick to Krita for that. I guess I'll use Designer 2 for mostly vector stuff, and Photo 2 for mostly photography stuff. I'm fine with doing my initial drafts in Krita, then bringing that offer to Designer 2 to generate final vector renderings. Kinda like when others sketch on paper then import a scan to do final vector work.

[ARTurek]

14 hours ago, Grant Robertson said:

Not being able to rotate the canvas with just two fingers on my touch screen.....

If you have touch on the tablet then you can rotate. Just remember to always start by right-clicking the pen [RPB]. This way you mark the pivot point of the view. Without this action, the rotation will be unpredictable or will not work at all.

[RPB].[Ctrl]+[Alt]+[2 Fingers (Vertical)] = Rotate 10° Left/Right
[RPB].[Alt]+[2 Fingers (Vertical)] = Rotate 1° Left/Right

[RPB].[2 Fingers (Vertical)] = Pan (Up/Down)
[RPB]/[2 fingers (horizontal movement)] = panorama view (left/right)

[RPB].[2finger(remove fingers)] = zoom in view
[RPB].[2 Fingers (Zoom)] = Zoom out

[MurphysBud]

Hi I'm new to this forum.  I was about to purchase Affinity Photo 2 after hearing good things but after researching the topic of rotating the canvas and learning there is no dedicated "rotate canvas" tool I am not going to purchase.  I am a long time Photoshop user and also Corel Painter user (and occasionally use Clip Studio).  All these programs have a dedicated "rotate canvas" tool that is an essential part of my workflow: I use a Cintiq 27QHD that does not have touch features and considering that Wacom products last for years I won't have touch features for many more years - instead I use a small gaming keyboard and click the "rotate canvas" tool and rotate.  I rotate constantly while drawing/painting and I can't imagine not having the ability to do this.   I also have recently been learning Storyboard Pro - just want to mention that SB Pro also has a rotate canvas tool, but  (like Affinity Photo) they also have an option to rotate the canvas with keyboard clicks of incremental rotations - so I've tried this method in SB Pro and do not like it.  I never use it in Storyboard Pro but instead use the "free" rotate canvas tool.  So again for me the lack of a "Rotate Canvas" tool sadly was a dealbreaker for me when thinking about purchasing Affinity Photo 2.  I'll keep using my old PS CS6, Painter 2023 and Clip Studio and check back on Affinity Photo in the future.  Once Affinity Photo gets this feature, if the price is still good as it is now and not subscription based I will strongly consider purchasing it.

[iconoclast]

10 hours ago, MurphysBud said:

Hi I'm new to this forum.  I was about to purchase Affinity Photo 2 after hearing good things but after researching the topic of rotating the canvas and learning there is no dedicated "rotate canvas" tool I am not going to purchase.  I am a long time Photoshop user and also Corel Painter user (and occasionally use Clip Studio).  All these programs have a dedicated "rotate canvas" tool that is an essential part of my workflow: I use a Cintiq 27QHD that does not have touch features and considering that Wacom products last for years I won't have touch features for many more years - instead I use a small gaming keyboard and click the "rotate canvas" tool and rotate.  I rotate constantly while drawing/painting and I can't imagine not having the ability to do this.   I also have recently been learning Storyboard Pro - just want to mention that SB Pro also has a rotate canvas tool, but  (like Affinity Photo) they also have an option to rotate the canvas with keyboard clicks of incremental rotations - so I've tried this method in SB Pro and do not like it.  I never use it in Storyboard Pro but instead use the "free" rotate canvas tool.  So again for me the lack of a "Rotate Canvas" tool sadly was a dealbreaker for me when thinking about purchasing Affinity Photo 2.  I'll keep using my old PS CS6, Painter 2023 and Clip Studio and check back on Affinity Photo in the future.  Once Affinity Photo gets this feature, if the price is still good as it is now and not subscription based I will strongly consider purchasing it.

Hi!

There are two relative simple ways to do that: 1. Hold "Alt" and scroll with the scroll wheel of your mouse, 2. per shortkeys.  I defined special ones for my needs ">" for "rotate to the rignt", "<" for rotate to the left", "Shift + Ctrl  + <" for "reset rotation" (Windows) This rotates in steps. It may seem unfamiliar the first time, but I got used to it quickly. By the way, the best way to rotate canvas I personally know, is the one in GIMP. I didn't like the Photoshop way. It should not be necessary to have a seperate tool for it.

[MurphysBud]

On 8/15/2024 at 11:59 PM, iconoclast said:

Hi!

There are two relative simple ways to do that: 1. Hold "Alt" and scroll with the scroll wheel of your mouse, 2. per shortkeys.  I defined special ones for my needs ">" for "rotate to the rignt", "<" for rotate to the left", "Shift + Ctrl  + <" for "reset rotation" (Windows) This rotates in steps. It may seem unfamiliar the first time, but I got used to it quickly. By the way, the best way to rotate canvas I personally know, is the one in GIMP. I didn't like the Photoshop way. It should not be necessary to have a seperate tool for it.

Thanks for the response!  I don't use a mouse - instead I'm using a Wacom pen so Option 1 doesn't work for me.  For option 2 I explained in my post that the "rotate in steps" scenario is not ideal for my workflow.  Yes it's better than nothing and as I explained in my post I have used a similar "rotation in steps" method in Storyboard Pro and hate it.  Just pointing out that I understand that method.  I prefer a "free" rotation where I can drag my pen on screen and rotate the canvas smoothly to any angle as seen in Photoshop, Painter, Clip Studio and others.  The downside to rotating in steps is you can't get the exact angle you desire, it takes more time to tap on the keyboard, and over time (if you rotate your Canvas a lot as part of your workflow) it's murder on your wrists having to tap the keyboard constantly.  This is similar to tapping "Control +" and "Control -" in Photoshop to Zoom In/Out - this is extremely hard on the wrists, and I actually already have mild carpal tunnel from years of doing this sort of thing.  When PS introduced the "scrubby zoom" feature it took a lot of wear and tear off my wrists because I could activate the Zoom tool and then simply scrub my pen across the screen which reduced constant keyboard taps to zoom in and out incrementally.  The "scrubby zoom" in Photoshop is similar to what a "free" Canvas Rotation tool does.  As part of my workflow I rotate my canvas constantly while painting so the "rotate in steps" option doesn't work for me.

I've never used GIMP so I can't comment on how it works.

So to clarify my original post in case I wasn't clear - I want a Rotation Tool that allow you to rotate the Canvas "freely" at any angle by dragging your pen on the screen.  In Photoshop this tool is in the Toolbox as part of a suite of Navigation Tools: the Zoom Tool, the Hand (pan) Tool, and the Rotate View tool. In Painter it's the same three tools in the Toolbox - the "Grabber", "Magnifier" and "Rotate Page" Tool.  Clip Studio also allows for free rotation.

[iconoclast]

@MurphysBud

I think, I understand what you mean. In GIMP, Krita and ArtRage, you can rotate the canvas by simply holding a modifier key (Shift on GIMP and Krita, Alt on ArtRage) and the middle mouse key attached to your stylus button, by dragging with the stylus. It's an option like scrolling or zooming. You don't need to change a tool for it. That's very convenient and the way I prefer. But unfortunately Affinity doesn't offer this option. I work with a Wacom Cintiq too, but I also have a mouse besides my tablet, so I can even use it for rotating the canvas. Often even the rotation in steps is good enough for me. It's something I got used to during the last years. But it would of course be better if we could rotate like in the apps I mentioned above. By the way, all three apps also have options to mirror the canvas. That's very helpful for painting and drawing too.

[MurphysBud]

13 minutes ago, iconoclast said:

@MurphysBud

I think, I understand what you mean. In GIMP, Krita and ArtRage, you can rotate the canvas by simply holding a modifier key (Shift on GIMP and Krita, Alt on ArtRage) and the middle mouse key attached to your stylus button, by dragging with the stylus. It's an option like scrolling or zooming. You don't need to change a tool for it. That's very convenient and the way I prefer. But unfortunately Affinity doesn't offer this option. I work with a Wacom Cintiq too, but I also have a mouse besides my tablet, so I can even use it for rotating the canvas. Often even the rotation in steps is good enough for me. It's something I got used to during the last years. But it would of course be better if we could rotate like in the apps I mentioned above. By the way, all three apps also have options to mirror the canvas. That's very helpful for painting and drawing too.

Thanks for the info.  Regarding GIMP, Krita and Artrage, holding a modifier key to rotate sounds like the best option.  In fact I just checked in Painter 2023 and you can actually do this by holding Spacebar+Alt while using the brush.  Wow I didn't even realize this.  But effectively it gets you the same function as when you switch to the "Rotate Page" tool.  So really the "free rotate" functionality is what I'm after.  A modifier key would be the best way to go for me, followed by a dedicated tool.  I see the difference now.

Also thanks for pointing out the mirror options.  I've been thinking about getting Affinity Photo - I was about to make the jump and then learned about the rotation limitations and that held me back.  I use Painter 2023 most of the time but also use PS CS6 still on Windows 10.  With Windows 10 support ending and the likelihood that CS6 won't work on Windows 11 I feel like I need something to replace it and I don't want to pay for a subscription to the current PS.

[iconoclast]

As far as I remember, I started a feature request for this rotation feature and the mirroring feature as well some years ago here in the Feature Request Section. Possibly it will come some day with an update or a new version. Anyway, the Affinity apps are very good. I'm very glad about that I explored them some years ago, as I decided to turn my back to Adobe. At first I only purchased Publisher, because I needed a DTP Software urgently. But I was so excited about it that I purchased the other apps too.