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I Am Submitting a Protest


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Hello,

When I originally purchased the full Affinity Suite, you sold it as a one time purchase that gave me access to all future updates. However, now you are billing Affinity 2 as a separate product - a new version, which it IS NOT a separate or new product, it’s just an upgrade, something you should NOT be charging for, something you originally said you would NOT charge for. That's the whole concept of a "one time purchase."

You are now selling an entire new Affinity Suite. This is not fair and NOT what I paid for.

So let me ask, will there be upgrades to the Original Affinity Suite? Is it still supported?  Are you now phasing out the Original Affinity Suite, and does that mean that I’ll be FORCED to buy the new suite if I want to continue using your products?

This looks and feels like you’re slowly moving to the Adobe model. Just like them, it used to be a TRUE onetime purchase, then they moved to the subscription model.

It sure looks like you decided to choose larger profits over customer satisfaction, like so many companies these days, squeezing every penny out of their customers.  You can still make good profits with one time purchases, add-ons and extra features without trying to bleed your customers dry.

I am VERY Disappointed and VERY surprised that you came out strong as a viable alternative to Adobe, only to follow them down the same profits over customers path, and that you did it so quickly.  I can't wait to see what happens next year.

I will continue to use the Original Affinity Suite for the moment because I like your product and for the moment, you’re still cheaper than Adobe.  But I want it noted that I am aware of what you’re doing, and I think it’s not fair and it’s not what I originally purchased. You changed the deal.

And, FYI, I’m going to post this as comments on public forms and create a video about it (not that you care, I’m just small potatoes to you), but I want people to at least be aware of this and to keep an eye on you and to keep an eye out for another replacement product.

Signed,
Disheartened and Disappointed Customer

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30 minutes ago, Ben Taylor said:

So let me ask, will there be upgrades to the Original Affinity Suite?

image.png.d0a930fe2183cb2fd6def94c355401b2.png

 

30 minutes ago, Ben Taylor said:

Are you now phasing out the Original Affinity Suite, and does that mean that I’ll be FORCED to buy the new suite if I want to continue using your products?

No, you can still use V1. Its functionality is not limited in any way, only that it will no longer receive updates.

 

30 minutes ago, Ben Taylor said:

When I originally purchased the full Affinity Suite, you sold it as a one time purchase that gave me access to all future updates.

Yes, all V1 update versions were provided for free. But upgrading V1 to V2 is not an "update".

 

Edited by Pšenda

Affinity Store (MSI/EXE): Affinity Suite (ADe, APh, APu) 2.4.0.2301
Dell OptiPlex 7060, i5-8500 3.00 GHz, 16 GB, Intel UHD Graphics 630, Dell P2417H 1920 x 1080, Windows 11 Pro, Version 23H2, Build 22631.3155.
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I just have to point out that Update and Upgrade are words with quite different definitions.

Mac Pro (Late 2013) Mac OS 12.7.4 
Affinity Designer 2.4.0 | Affinity Photo 2.4.0 | Affinity Publisher 2.4.0 | Beta versions as they appear.

I have never mastered color management, period, so I cannot help with that.

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Adobe prior subscription model was selling version upgrades approximately for a 1/5 of the full price. If you don't upgrade you still got some free updates. Now we have each year a new macOS and iPadOS release, with the possibility to make older software sooner unusable on newer OS releases. Serif can provide such minor updates without new features only to maintain V1 usable and secure if they want. I remember an extra free update of QuarkXPress 10 to make it usable on the newer OS X El Capitan. Nobody knows if the Affinity Suite V1 will be working on macOS 14 and iPadOS 17. On iPadOS some will have to stay at Affinity 1.10 until the UI is fixed, to avoid eye strain and harm.

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I find some of these complaints in regard to update costs somewhat baffling.

8 years ago the first version of Affinity Designer was released. 7 years ago Photo. 3 years ago Publisher.

Throughout that time customers received free updates and upgrades, and many new users purchased the software at a reduced special offer price. I am one of those.

All the free updates actually made me feel I ought to ask Serif to charge me MORE, because the cost for V1 in relation to its functionality was always greatly in favour of its feature set. In short: very inexpensive for what was on offer.

V2 is a new release of Affinity. It is offered again at small cost compared to other commercial alternatives. V1 continues to run and isn't 'taken away'. There is no subscription. Unlike companies such as Adobe, older versions are not removed from the user's installation options. Serif's business model is based on the "you pay for it, you have an unlimited license" approach, which is actively abandoned by most other software companies.

Yet: like it or not, Serif has to generate revenue to cover development costs. They can't forever keep leaning on bringing in new users. The Affinity devs have always stated that free updates would be available for V1.xx. They stated unequivocally that V2.XX would become a paid upgrade.

Now, I understand that if a user purchased the software in the last 3 months, having to pay for a full upgrade is understandably inconvenient, and it would have been perhaps preferable for Serif to handle those cases differently.

But surely enough, at SOME point Serif has to make SOME money, otherwise business becomes untenable and they'll go bankrupt. Right?

Or perhaps Serif has a good reason to go down the subscription route after all: even IF you try with your best intentions to provide professional-level design software at a very affordable price level, AND offer 50% off to everyone at release time, STILL people complain about it.

If I were them, the subscription business model suddenly is beginning to look quite attractive. Because there is no use in trying to please everyone anyway.

PS I do agree that a grace period of 1 year or so to fix critical bugs in V1 would have been good to have and alleviate part of the complaints made.

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7 minutes ago, Medical Officer Bones said:

Unlike companies such as Adobe, older versions are not removed from the user's installation options

I still can use my Adobe CS4, CS5 and CS6 apps on my Intel macMini and older MacBook, without subscription. I reinstalled and activated them several times and requested free download links.

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Just now, Artsketch said:

I still can use my Adobe CS4 and CS5 Apps on my Intel macMini, without subscription. I reinstalled severel time and requested free download links.

Then you are lucky and privileged: because many pre-CS6 users have had no luck at all, even when they contacted Adobe. And you are proving my point: in the classic software business model older versions would continue to run (albeit on older operating systems and hardware).

In any case this is only true for legacy pre-subscription Adobe users. Current subscribed users lose access to previous versions older than 2 releases.

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1 hour ago, Ben Taylor said:

And, FYI, I’m going to post this as comments on public forms and create a video about it (not that you care, I’m just small potatoes to you), but I want people to at least be aware of this and to keep an eye on you and to keep an eye out for another replacement product.

This reads as if your very happiness in life depends on a piece of software. A very mature and balanced response.

I noticed you created a new account to share your deeply felt outrage with this community.

pitchfork.png.91682f4ac0a471751c61bb310fff3bef.png

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13 minutes ago, Medical Officer Bones said:

Then you are lucky and privileged

Yes, sometimes I prefer Photoshop CS5 over my Photoshop CC subscription. With JumpDesktop I'm able to access and use these older software on all my new devices. Affinity V1 iPadOS versions would be difficult because iPadOS downgrade isn't easy, when necessary. 

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I clicked on this topic because I thought it was a joke. And I'm quite surprised it is not. 

So for the OP I will paste here my thoughts I already expressed somewhere else. 

 

As much as I'd welcome some appreciation for existing users, I can hardly be mad at Serif.

How much did people think these upgrades would be? I believe the original price was around 60$ per app. And now we have all three apps for Mac, Windows AND iPad for 100$. That's 33$ per app for major upgrade. Come on!

Should I be jealous that new customers get the same 40% discount as me? Why? I myself want more users for Affinity community! The more people here and less people at Adobe the better. 😉

It's been known for years that free upgrades would only be available for all the versions numbered 1.x until version 2 comes out. And I think this is much better approach than the Adobe's way.
You can still be using V1 of all the apps, I guess forever (although without updates and much support I reckon).
But for this bargain price I won't hesitate a second to get the Universal Licence.
And I will keep using V2 with all the upgrades again until V3 comes out in a few years.
And then I will happily pay again for V3.
Seems fair to both customers and developers - they've put a lot of work to make all of these apps as brilliant as they are.

Big thanks to everyone at Serif! 👍🏻🤩🥳

 

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1 minute ago, Artsketch said:

Yes, sometimes I prefer Photoshop CS5 over my Photoshop CC subscription. With JumpDesktop I'm able to access and use these older software on all my new devices. Affinity V1 iPadOS versions would be difficult because iPadOS downgrade isn't easy.

CS5 and CS6 were arguably two of the best releases. Efficient, stable, and great performance. I still have those installed as well. In comparison, the current state of much of the apps is in disarray.

Photoshop CC 2023 is often a trial in patience to work in. Animate is a disaster area compared to the old Flash. Most of the CC apps are slow to work with, even on solid specced machines.

That said, I still rely on InDesign. I had expected to have made the switch to Publisher 2, but the critical lack of 1bit image support prevents me from doing so. Such a shame.

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12 minutes ago, brunoczech said:

As much as I'd welcome some appreciation for existing users, I can hardly be mad at Serif.

Software is merely a tool. If it works for you: use it. If it does not, don't. Switch to a different tool or adjust your approach.

A tool or company is not something to invest emotionally in. Appreciate them for what they do: sure. Become enraged and furious? Waste of time and energy. Redirect to positive and constructive thinking and emotions instead. Walk away from your computer and hug your spouse, offspring, pet, or that beautiful tree 🙂

(unless of course a company actively takes part in the wanton destruction of our beautiful Earth and/or causes suffering. Time to become enraged and do something about it...)

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3 hours ago, Medical Officer Bones said:

Or perhaps Serif has a good reason to go down the subscription route after all: even IF you try with your best intentions to provide professional-level design software at a very affordable price level, AND offer 50% off to everyone at release time, STILL people complain about it.

If I were them, the subscription business model suddenly is beginning to look quite attractive. Because there is no use in trying to please everyone anyway.

Exactly. I don't like v2 for some reasons but all that whining about the price and the need to purchase an upgrade is a joke.

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I would've kicked myself if I didn't take advantage and buy the whole suite for $100. My main interest was Photo, then Design. I was gonna just get those 2 but then saw I can get Publisher for $20 more so....

If you can get a copy of Call of Duty MW2 for $70 without whining because you had the earlier versions, you can do this.

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8 hours ago, Ben Taylor said:

And, FYI, I’m going to post this as comments on public forms and create a video about it (not that you care, I’m just small potatoes to you), but I want people to at least be aware of this and to keep an eye on you and to keep an eye out for another replacement product.

Signed,
Disheartened and Disappointed Customer

This post is a joke, right?

website

Mac mini (2018)  3.2 GHz Intel Core i7  64 GB • Radeon Pro 580 8 GB • macOS Monterey

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I can see both sides of the argument, but I must say that Serif have always been very clear about their update and upgrade policies. It really doesn't take a lot of effort to check these out before you buy. While I can understand that some people may be a bit put out that they have to "pay again" for an upgrade to a product, (based on their "assumptions", rather than on what Serif actualy say!) it really seems naïve to think that a business can survive for long by selling a piece of software once and then supplying free upgrades for ever more!

FWIW I was a bit put out myself recently with another app that I use. Every now and then, a bit like Affinity, there is a popup saying that an update is available, so I click on the link, download and install it. The last time this happened, when I opened the "updated" app I got a message saying that I needed to purchase it, at more than twice the cost I had originally paid for it! I queried this with their customer service and was told that, as it was a new version, I would have to pay for it, or I could just continue using the old version. (Fair enough - that's what I decided to do.) What I objected to was the rather sneaky way of making a paid upgrade look like a regular update!

In comparison, with Affinity you do not just get a message saying that an update is available and it is only after the new version has been installed that you discover it has to be paid for. Serif are very fair and clear about charging for new versions of their products, and while I have no problem with people querying the policy, I'm afraid I do get rather annoyed by some of the vitriol (and bluntly, the plain stupidity) of some of the complaints!

Acer XC-895 : Core i5-10400 Hexa-core 2.90 GHz :  32GB RAM : Intel UHD Graphics 630 : Windows 10 Home
Affinity Publisher 2 : Affinity Photo 2 : Affinity Designer 2 : (latest release versions) on desktop and iPad

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4 hours ago, TomM1 said:

This post is a joke, right?

I must admit that I'm always rather amused by people who threaten to do things like "stop recommending your product" if they don't get what they want!

Personally I find a much better way to get my own way, is to lie on the ground, hit it with my little fists and scream and scream until I'm sick! 😁

Acer XC-895 : Core i5-10400 Hexa-core 2.90 GHz :  32GB RAM : Intel UHD Graphics 630 : Windows 10 Home
Affinity Publisher 2 : Affinity Photo 2 : Affinity Designer 2 : (latest release versions) on desktop and iPad

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This thread is so much of this forum all in one place.

Microsoft Windows 10 Home (Build 19045)
AMD Ryzen 7 5800X @ 3.8Ghz (-30 all core +200mhz PBO); Mobo: Asus X470 Prime Pro
32GB DDR4 (3600Mhz); EVGA NVIDIA GeForce GTX 3080 X3C Ultra 12GB
Monitor 1 4K @ 125% due to a bug
Monitor 2 4K @ 150%
Monitor 3 (as needed) 1080p @ 100%

WACOM Intuos4 Large; X-rite i1Display Pro; NIKON D5600 DSLR

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