Extremely Disappointed, Existing Customers must Purchase Affinity V2

[Paul Martin]

On 11/10/2022 at 6:05 PM, Dhillf2w said:

I am extremely disappointed to see that Affinity requires existing customers to purchase the V2 upgrade to the products they have already purchased. I have always been a fan of Affinity, but this seriously skews my affinity of the company.

I believe Affinity products are still great and offered at great prices. I love that Affinity hasn't bowed to the greed of more-money with subscription-only services such as the big graphic software companies that moved in that direction, which I believe was a strong reason behind the creation of Affinity, and is most definitely a big reason for it's success. BUT, the decision to make existing customers repurchase all of the products again to get V2 is an extremely poor one. I would suspect many customers will stick with V1 simply because they will not be manipulated to purchase the products again, not because they don't want them, but because they are angry with Affinity.

I do a lot of music production, and in the music industry there are many users who refuse to pay for subscription services. They want to own what they purchase, just like so many who have purchased Affinity products. But they prefer to purchase software from companies that don't  keep charging them for upgrades. My Digital Audio Workstation (DAW) of choice is Logic Pro X and I have never been charged for an upgrade; in fact, the community of Logic users looks forward with great anticipation and excitement to the new upgrades. This is what makes Logic users such huge fans of the software and the company—when the company rewards its customers with great upgrades at no additional cost; the company supports their customers. There are many third party companies that offer plug-ins for Logic, and some of these companies, such as Waves are getting a bad rap in the music community, because they require purchasing an upgrade license every few years in order to continue getting upgrades for the products they bought; they will lose many customers, but for those they keep, at least they are offered an incentive as a customer. Other companies such as iZotope treat their existing customers to deeply discounted loyalty offers for upgrades and newly released software and their customers are happy to pay a discounted fee to upgrade, and the company retains their admiration and respect. But Affinity, just insulted their entire customer base. Good luck with that.

Once, a huge advocate of Affinity, my admiration, respect, and excitement for Affinity and it's products has now plummeted. For those who think this is too harsh, please realize, this isn't about customers, like me, saving a buck—it's about Affinity wanting to show appreciation for the loyal customers who made them successful. I mourn the direction Affinity has chosen.

Sincerely

Your definition of "loyal" appears to be to buy a cheap product and then expect it to be continually upgraded at no cost to you. Is this a business model worth the name?

[Hawked]

9 minutes ago, Paul Martin said:

Your definition of "loyal" appears to be to buy a cheap product and then expect it to be continually upgraded at no cost to you. Is this a business model worth the name?

That's not the issue, because they're not selling the upgrades. They're selling the exact same product + an upgrade for almost double. Even with the discount, you're paying almost the same price as V1, for an upgrade.

Imagine going to the garage and being told you need to buy the entire car again just to change the tires, I'd not be happy about it. Especially if I'm being told not to worry and that I'm getting a discount on the car.

As great as the software is, this is a predatory practice and a slap in the face of existing customers.

[Poor Composition]

2 hours ago, Hilltop said:

That's too bad. Did you buy version 1 at the full prices or was it already discounted?

It was discounted.

Kind of funny. I bought both ON1 and Affinity Photo in August, both discounted. When ON1 updated to 2023, they sent me a message unprompted that they'd be providing me a free upgrade as a recent purchaser. They also gave me the same bonus assets they were giving to people who bought the new version at full price on release, which seemed extremely generous.

I bought Affinity Photo and ON1 looking for the posisbility to move to something new when Skylum changed the pricing/update model on Luminar Neo. It looks like which way to go worked itself out.

[mizwizzy]

I've enjoyed using Affinity v1 with any/all improvements provided along the way. It was refreshing to find software that wasn't so expensive and it was on par with the big guys even though it had room for improvements. Will I upgrade to V2? Probably in time. Am I being required/forced to? Not at all. V1 will work fine and I'm not on a yearly subscription, which I'm most grateful for!

All software companies require money for future upgrades. They don't spend hours perfecting things without compensation. We get paid at our jobs to forfeit personal time (overtime pay) so why shouldn't they?

As loyal customers, we're not devaluated with a 40% launch discount. Just because new customers get the same discount doesn't take away the value in any way. If I go to Costco and I buy a new TV on sale and my next door neighbor does the same, we're both still happy. The glass is half full, not half empty.

Enjoy the upgrade and make this software become a top contender. 

[JensOlsson]

Very reasonable pricing. But we bought affinity photo and designer 30 days ago for the whole team. 
Now we get an email that we will not get any updates. We have’nt even had the chance to get started using it fully. 

Those who bought v1 in the recent 6 or 12 months should get the upgrade for free I think. That would be fair since v1 is no longer updated. 

[_fluffy]

I understand and agree with people who are upset that they bought it a few months ago and then are being asked to buy it again, rather than getting an upgrade grace period. There are many mechanisms that Affinity Serif could use to verify the purchase being recent and then extend a free license to those users (regardless of how they bought the license).

However, I absolutely do not understand people who are upset that they have to pay another $40 (or $100) to update a product they’ve had for years and then, as a response, say they’ll go back to Adobe, of all things.

[Hilltop]

28 minutes ago, Poor Composition said:

It was discounted.

Kind of funny. I bought both ON1 and Affinity Photo in August, both discounted. When ON1 updated to 2023, they sent me a message unprompted that they'd be providing me a free upgrade as a recent purchaser. They also gave me the same bonus assets they were giving to people who bought the new version at full price on release, which seemed extremely generous.

Fact is that On1's upgrade came a month before Affinity's, so the time between your purchase and the upgrade was much shorter. However, I can feel your pain. I would approach Sales again and paint the full picture (again) and ask them if you can get a refund for version 1 and pay the current price for version 2. 

[mizwizzy]

24 minutes ago, JensOlsson said:

Very reasonable pricing. But we bought affinity photo and designer 30 days ago for the whole team. 
Now we get an email that we will not get any updates. We have’nt even had the chance to get started using it fully. 

Those who bought v1 in the recent 6 or 12 months should get the upgrade for free I think. That would be fair since v1 is no longer updated. 

When I bought v1, I had 2 or 3 updates. Anyone who bought v1 (prior to v2) would not start with an older version. **You would get the latest v1 that everyone has.** That's fair for all using v1. 

[JensOlsson]

2 minutes ago, mizwizzy said:

When I bought v1, I had 2 or 3 updates. Anyone who bought v1 (prior to v2) would not start with an older version. **You would get the latest v1 that everyone has.** That's fair for all using v1. 

I dont agree. When buying a software you can usually expect to get bugs fixed, any new operating system incompatibilities fixed etc. At least for 12 months or so. 

[jpmb76]

When I learned that there is a new version of Affinity I wanted to upgrade straight away.

Logged in to my account looking for upgrade options and couldn't believe there's none.

I mean,  come on guys, even Adobe, before they've done the subscription thing had full price for new customers and upgrade price for existing ones. So in my book, not cool.

Price and so called 40% discount.

There are not so many improvements to the software to justify 40% price increase, and given the fact that it's now an app and not a program like before I think you have gone too far and you know it.

That is way you slapped that V2 launch offer of 40% to bring the price down to what it was before.

The only benefits I see is to buy the whole Affinity Suite that you call V2 Universal Licence.

Now, I don't care for Mac or iPadOS versions but I can clearly see that there is 20% discount on every single product compared to the prices of previous version and that alone is good enough reason for me to buy Affinity 2, which I did.

I'm going to ask for a refund because you've turned good programs into crappy apps, invisible to other programs, but that's for another thread.

 

[Poor Composition]

26 minutes ago, Hilltop said:

Fact is that On1's upgrade came a month before Affinity's, so the time between your purchase and the upgrade was much shorter. However, I can feel your pain. I would approach Sales again and paint the full picture (again) and ask them if you can get a refund for version 1 and pay the current price for version 2. 

I'd just be bugging a support person who doesn't make the decisions. If they're going to make a change, they'll make a change for everyone affected. I don't see them making a special exception for me becasue I asked again.

 

Edited November 11, 2022 by Poor Composition
horrible grammar

[Jimo]

2 minutes ago, jpmb76 said:

even Adobe, before they've done the subscription thing had full price for new customers and upgrade price for existing ones

How much did those cost? Was it £36 each like the Affinity apps are? Or £60 each before the current discount? Could you get Photoshop AND Illustrator AND InDesign for an upgrade fee of £89? Was the upgrade price for the three Creative Suite tools the same, or less for the Affinity Universal Licence even at the non-discount rate of £155?

How much did those Adobe tools cost to buy in the first place? How many full version updrades to Affinity do you think the same amount of money could pay for?

 

[Gianni Becattini]

8 hours ago, VectorVonDoom said:

That is simply nonsense. As you say and know everyone has a discount therefore (current) customers patently aren’t be ignored they’re being treated as equals which isn’t the same thing. What you want is double special treatment. As for going back to Adobe, if it suits your requirements better then do it however don’t pretend they treat customers better and it’s a strange one that you’re complaining about cost and then talking about going back to them!

This moaning about something that’s not going to change and isn’t unreasonable, they’ve explained their reasoning, is getting too much, just typical internet. So I’m giving up for on here for a while as I don’t tolerate all this non-constructive whining well.

Sorry, I never wished to offend anybody, it is not my attitude. If so, I excuse myself.

I just expressed my opinion, of which I am absolutely convinced. I was supporting Serif (in more ways that you can imagine) and just note that the customers who helped Affinity to grow did not receive neither one euro discount. You can think that this is normal. I didn't like it. Am I allowed to say that?

[jpmb76]

7 minutes ago, Jimo said:

How much did those cost? Was it £36 each like the Affinity apps are? Or £60 each before the current discount? Could you get Photoshop AND Illustrator AND InDesign for an upgrade fee of £89? Was the upgrade price for the three Creative Suite tools the same, or less for the Affinity Universal Licence even at the non-discount rate of £155?

How much did those Adobe tools cost to buy in the first place? How many full version updrades to Affinity do you think the same amount of money could pay for?

 

Adobe was mentioned just as example, not to compare prices of each developer.

Ok, I give you another one.

To download images from my memory cards to PC I use program called Downloader Pro.

The full version costs $45 and if you are existing user and want to upgrade then the price is just $23, and you get free upgrades for 18 months from the date of purchase.

Better?

[debraspicher]

With V1, we received free updates. With V2, it is an upgrade from v1 to a new platform that no longer has to support V1 code. The platform differences between the two is what impacts licensing (thus price) in this case.

https://www.geeksforgeeks.org/difference-between-update-and-upgrade/

[iuli]

The alternative to be a slave to Adobe’s subscription model will never be a free graphic software. As an existing user I always knew the 2.0 will be paid and I never expected to pay less. Moreover, as a former Adobe user, I’m happy to pay as much as Serif asks as long as the products remain one-time purchases for major releases, and I know I’m not alone. No one wants to see a world without Affinity.

In my opinion we cannot expect both Affinity to remain subscription-free, and a free product for the vast majority of users. Especially the existing customers should be well aware of the pains of a Serif-less world. That’s graphic’s apocalypse.

[Hilltop]

1 hour ago, Poor Composition said:

I'd just be bugging a support person who doesn't make the decisions. If they're going to make a change, they'll make a change for everyone affected. I don't see them making a special exception for me becasue I asked again.

 

Suit yourself. Anyway, hope you enjoy the Afiinity app(s).

[Embie]

It looks like this is the first step to became adobe-kid-of-suckers.
Of course, it is possible to ask some money for a big update, and of course, the price with 40% discount is ok.
But you promise me as buyer a lifetime subscription with updates.
The marketing guys advised you in the wrong way, this is exactly the trick I am too good for,
not good for your image.

Just tell the truth, and give buyers from the past a better discount than new buyers.

[Intuos5]

37 minutes ago, iuli said:

The alternative to be a slave to Adobe’s subscription model will never be a free graphic software.

Krita, it's free and open source. It is already the best digital drawing/ painting software I have used and its getting better still. It will soon be the Blender of 2D graphics once the text update hits. So you can support it... There's a great community too.

Would be cool if Affinity would support Krita's format so you can more easily use it as companion

[iuli]

Hi @Intuos5,

I’m mainly an iPad user on a (powerful) M1 iPad Pro, as many other users are. Although there are some only-vector and only-raster mobile software on the iPad, overall there’s no raster/vector integration at all. Now with the debut of StudioLink on the iPad nothing comes even closer on mobile to what Serif offers.

Kind regards.

[Tia Lapis]

51 minutes ago, Embie said:

But you promise me as buyer a lifetime subscription with updates.
 

Hmm? Serif never said this. They where clear from the start that a new major version would cost money.

[rossbryon]

Are you serious? The Affinity suite is the best value graphics software we've ever seen! Have you forgotten what we used to pay (and still do) for Adobe apps. Really, stop yer bellyaching' and appreciate the incredible value here.

[Mister Mike]

7 hours ago, Poor Composition said:

Having purchased the product at the end of August, it seems a little much to turn around and buy it again shortly afterward. I wouldn't have purchased it if I knew it was going EOL in a couple months.

Yep same boat. Recently purchase. Now annoyed at having to buy again. I purchased direct from affinity so it's easy for them to offer a sweetener. Every other product that has had a paid upgrade path all recognised registered users regardless of "where" they purchased it. Affinity dropped the ball big time.

[Poor Composition]

9 hours ago, Hilltop said:

Suit yourself. Anyway, hope you enjoy the Afiinity app(s).

Thanks, but I uninstalled. No use wasting time on top of money for a dead app.

[MKJJ]

On 11/10/2022 at 7:21 PM, Hilltop said:

With all due respect, but your position and arguments are ridiculous. Every software upgrade offered by a commercial company comes with a price. You can now purchase the app(s) at a 40% discount and that's quite generous.

Not so fast! I purchased licenses for Photo, Designer and Publisher a year ago for a special offer and paid around 75 EUR. Now, I would have to pay MORE for the upgrade? Seriously? In more than 30 years I have never ever had to pay more for an upgrade than for the original license. That's a strange license policy.