Ability to convert missing fonts to curves instead of replacing them when opening PDFs

[Blake_S]

Currently the only option in Designer to deal with missing fonts is to replace them.

Even if you choose not to replace them, text is still displayed using the wrong, replaced fonts, and if you attempt to convert it to curves, the version with the wrong fonts will be the one converted.

It would be a good alternative to be able to convert text with missing fonts to curves instead, using the embedded fonts data from the PDF, if the fonts are embedded.

Current version of Adobe Acrobat Pro can do it for example via preflight fixup:
https://www.copperbottomdesign.com/blog/converting-fonts-to-outlines

Inkscape can also do it with this option when importing a PDF:

 

[deeds]

Agreed!

 

I think just about all other vector apps offer to convert to curves (the original missing fonts), and this is the way it should be, by default, so we can at least view as the original design for initial consideration of whether or not a font should be replaced or found, to do more work etc.

[GarryP]

Please pardon my ignorance but:

1. If the font is embedded in the PDF then it’s not “missing”, is it?

2. If the font is not embedded, and it's not on the user's system, then how can the text be converted to curves if the software doesn’t have access to the font and therefore doesn’t know what it looks like?

[Blake_S]

41 minutes ago, GarryP said:

. If the font is embedded in the PDF then it’s not “missing”, is it?

As far as Affinity products are concerned its missing. Affinity Designer replaces the font if its not installed locally, even if the font is embedded.

41 minutes ago, GarryP said:

If the font is not embedded, and it's not on the user's system

Re-read the post, I mentioned:

Quote

It would be a good alternative to be able to convert text with missing fonts to curves instead, using the embedded fonts data from the PDF, if the fonts are embedded.

The whole issue is when you have the data for the fonts in the file, and Designer is not using it.

[GarryP]

18 minutes ago, Blake_S said:

As far as Affinity products are concerned its missing. Affinity Designer replaces the font if its not installed locally, even if the font is embedded.

I didn’t know that. Do you know if there is a reason why the Affinity applications don’t/can’t use the embedded fonts?

18 minutes ago, Blake_S said:

The whole issue is when you have the data for the fonts in the file, and Designer is not using it.

Rather than a request to use the curves from the embedded fonts, would it not be better to request that the software use the embedded fonts?

Apologies if I’m missing information from other discussions about this; I don’t edit PDFs so this area is pretty new to me.

[PaulEC]

I'm also confused! If the font is embedded and Affinity was able to use embedded fonts, surely there is no need to convert to curves, as it could display the embedded fonts!

[Blake_S]

3 hours ago, GarryP said:

Rather than a request to use the curves from the embedded fonts, would it not be better to request that the software use the embedded fonts?

If the devs can do it, sure. But I haven't encountered any other programs that can do this. Illustrator can't.

Might be some kind of a licensing issue, like not allowing other people to use embedded font for editing purposes.

However I did list several programs that have an ability to convert embedded fonts to curves.

3 hours ago, N.P.M. said:

Xara Designer

Does it only show the correct font, or can you also export a PDF with the correct font?

[GarryP]

13 minutes ago, Blake_S said:

Might be some kind of a licensing issue, like not allowing other people to use embedded font for editing purposes.

Licencing issues could certainly be one of the reasons why an embedded font cannot be used with editing but I think that licence would probably also cover the design/curves of those fonts – that’s mostly what fonts are, after all – which is a possible reason why the curves cannot be used.

Other software which does convert to curves may be doing so without full consideration to the licencing. (E.g. Just because you do doesn’t mean that I should.)

Maybe a font expert will chip in with a definitive answer.

[GarryP]

12 minutes ago, N.P.M. said:

This has been discussed with the packaging option in afpublisher here

Too much complicated stuff for a hobbyist like me to understand.
Is there an ‘idiot-friendly one-line/paragraph version’ of that discussion?

[Blake_S]

From what I understand from that thread is that there are different sets of permissions that can be set on a font, and there is an "editable" permission.

This means that embedded fonts can be used for editing if they have that permission set. We can probably assume though that most of the fonts don't have it.

The question is - does converting to curves require "editable" permission or not.

[kenmcd]

5 hours ago, GarryP said:

2. If the font is not embedded, and it's not on the user's system, then how can the text be converted to curves if the software doesn’t have access to the font and therefore doesn’t know what it looks like?

The font is not needed. The curves are there on the page - you are looking at them. Which is why other applications and tools like GhostScript can convert an entire document to shapes without any fonts. The shapes are already in the PDF.

[GarryP]

26 minutes ago, LibreTraining said:

The curves are there on the page

Ah yes; makes complete sense when I think about it for more than a second; I completely missed that, thanks.
I knew an expert would have the answer.

[Dazmondo77]

On 9/22/2022 at 10:03 AM, Blake_S said:

It would be a good alternative to be able to convert text with missing fonts to curves instead, using the embedded fonts data from the PDF, if the fonts are embedded.

This is needed - most publications that carry ads request that all submitted PDFs have text converted to paths, and I'd say that probably 50% of the PDFs we used to receive when I was working on a monthly magazine, would still have embedded fonts, either that or we'd get a low-res raster ad thats been saved as a PDF, this led to a lot of chasing, and in some cases, ads not making the deadline - so although I no longer work on magazines, Text to paths when opening a PDF would be still be a massive help   

[Blake_S]

Not having this feature is very limiting...

Like today I had to fix a book cover we got from a client, and guess what - it can't be done in Designer, since it will replace all the fonts,
which we predictably don't have installed locally. Almost all files contain fonts that we do not have installed.

So instead we have to rely on Acrobat Pro with a PitStop plugin, which doesn't have even 5% of the features of programs like Designer / Illustrator.
It doesn't even have object alignment options...

Rasterizing fonts is also an option which does exist in Designer, but a bad one - there is a noticeable print quality degradation.