Power Duplicate in Affinity Photo

[Lem3]

I cannot get Power Duplicate to work in Photo 1.10.0.1127.  I'm following the process in Photo Help:

1. Select the layer(s).
2. From the Layer menu, select Duplicate.
3. Transform the duplicated layer content.
4. From the Layer menu, select Duplicate. A duplicate is created and the transform is automatically applied to the duplicate.
5. Repeat step 4 to create more duplicates with the transform accumulatively applied.

My steps:

1. Create a pixel layer in a new document.
2. Draw a selection with the rectangular marquee tool, fill with a color.
3. Ctrl-J to duplicate the layer
4. Use the left/up arrows to make an arbitrary transformation of the object.
5. Ctrl-J again to duplicate the new layer.  A third layer is created but the object is not transformed.

In addition to Ctrl-J I have used menu item Layer -> Duplicate and "Duplicate" from the layer context menu.  I assume I'm missing something simple here.

[Old Bruce]

7 minutes ago, Lem3 said:

• Use the left/up arrows to make an arbitrary transformation of the object.

I think this is where you have gone wrong. Enter the numbers into the appropriate fields, the up/down left/right arrows are read as finished with each click.

[Alfred]

I think the ‘marching ants’ selection is getting in the way. Try deselecting before the first ‘Duplicate’ command (and then reselect, if necessary, after the last one).

[Lem3]

1 hour ago, Old Bruce said:

I think this is where you have gone wrong. Enter the numbers into the appropriate fields, the up/down left/right arrows are read as finished with each click.

Are you referring to fields in the Transformation panel?  I'm not using that.  I'm using the keyboard arrows to get repeatable transformations.  I can, instead, make the initial transform by simply clicking on the object and dragging it to one side but duplicating the layer still results in a third layer identical to the second one.

[Lem3]

1 hour ago, Alfred said:

I think the ‘marching ants’ selection is getting in the way. Try deselecting before the first ‘Duplicate’ command (and then reselect, if necessary, after the last one).

Thanks for the suggestion, but the duplication still does not reflect the initial transformation.

[Ron P.]

My understanding from the Help File, and from experience, Power Duplication only works, when the transformation is entered into the Transform Panel OR when Dragging the duplicated object and then changing/transforming using the handles on the object.

[Lem3]

8 minutes ago, Ron P. said:

My understanding from the Help File, and from experience, Power Duplication only works, when the transformation is entered into the Transform Panel OR when Dragging the duplicated object and then changing/transforming using the handles on the object.

I didn't mention it but I also tried:
Duplicate
Move tool, drag
Duplicate

The second duplication did not reflect the transform. 

When the Help simply says "Transform the duplicated layer content" I assume any transformation method should work.  Having written a few operational manuals I'm aware how tenuous that assumption may be!

[Ron P.]

Are you clearing the Selection, ie; marching ants? It does not work the same way with a Selection. I tried 7-ways to Sunday to make it work following your directions. Not happening. I think it's designed that way. However it will if you;

1. Create and fill your selection
2. Deselect.
3. Duplicate CTL +J
4. Using the Transform Panel or Mouse, transform it/move it.
5. Press CTL +J, repeating as many times as you want.

For unknown reason(s), Power Duplicate does not work with a Selection active.

[Lem3]

1 hour ago, Ron P. said:

Are you clearing the Selection, ie; marching ants? It does not work the same way with a Selection. I tried 7-ways to Sunday to make it work following your directions. Not happening. I think it's designed that way. However it will if you;

1. Create and fill your selection
2. Deselect.
3. Duplicate CTL +J
4. Using the Transform Panel or Mouse, transform it/move it.
5. Press CTL +J, repeating as many times as you want.

For unknown reason(s), Power Duplicate does not work with a Selection active.

Nope, that doesn't work here.  Although, quite by accident, I discovered THIS works:

1. Create and fill the selection
2. Deselect
3. Duplicate (copy 1)
4. Move tool, drag Copy 1 to a new position
5. Duplicate.  This is copy 2, it will NOT reflect the transformation in Step 4.  Not for me.
6. Drag Copy 2 to a new position
7. Duplicate.  This is Copy 3, it (and all additional copies) will reflect the transformation in step 6.

Yes, I was careful to keep the appropriate layer selected at each step.
I'm starting to think this is not working as designed.

[Alfred]

6 hours ago, Ron P. said:

For unknown reason(s), Power Duplicate does not work with a Selection active.

That’s the same conclusion as I reached:

11 hours ago, Alfred said:

I think the ‘marching ants’ selection is getting in the way. Try deselecting before the first ‘Duplicate’ command (and then reselect, if necessary, after the last one).

For unknown reasons (as somebody famous once said) that does not seem to work for the OP:

9 hours ago, Lem3 said:

Thanks for the suggestion, but the duplication still does not reflect the initial transformation.

 

[David in Яuislip]

Try this

Create a pixel layer in a new document.
Draw a selection with the rectangular marquee tool, fill with a color.

Press V to select Move tool
<ctrl>D to deselect

Ctrl-J to duplicate the layer
Use the left/up arrows to make an arbitrary transformation of the object.

Make desired changes in the transform panel

Ctrl-J again to duplicate the new layer.  A third layer is created but the object is not transformed.

In the example below, the transform origin was moved to the intersection of the guides, the transform was 20° on rotation and +3 on height

[Alfred]

16 minutes ago, David in Яuislip said:

Make desired changes in the transform panel

It shouldn’t matter whether you make changes in the Transform panel or on the canvas.

[David in Яuislip]

12 minutes ago, Alfred said:

It shouldn’t matter whether you make changes in the Transform panel or on the canvas.

Ok, Rev 1 done with the mouse, I couldn't get 20°, will 19.96 do ?  

[Lem3]

Thanks, David, but that doesn't work here.  I made a copy of the object, transformed the copy by simply changing X and Y values in the Transform panel, then made a copy.  A third layer was created but the the object was not transformed.

I found another person who had the same experience: transform of the first duplicate is ignored, transforms of subsequent duplications are observed:

I get the same behavior on two (Windows) systems here.  I can't find any system settings that would affect this.

[walt.farrell]

1 hour ago, Lem3 said:

transformed the copy by simply changing X and Y values in the Transform panel

What change did you make?

[Lem3]

43 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

What change did you make?

I reduced the X/Y values initially showing in the transform panel by 50 px, e.g., if X was 950 I changed it to 900.  The object moved accordingly.

[walt.farrell]

9 minutes ago, Lem3 said:

I reduced the X/Y values initially showing in the transform panel by 50 px, e.g., if X was 950 I changed it to 900.  The object moved accordingly.

I think you may need to use an expression, e.g., -50, rather than an value like 900.

[Alfred]

41 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

I think you may need to use an expression, e.g., -50, rather than an value like 900.

If you specify -50 it will be interpreted as a (negative) value. For an expression you would need to express it (sorry!) as -=50 or whatever.

[Lem3]

Thanks, Walt,

That may be so, but the project I'm working on requires I visually align an object with other parts of the image.  The only-takes-8-seconds way of doing that is just drag it with the pen/mouse.  Except both my Photo installations do not reflect the on-canvas transform upon the second duplication.  Both do reflect transforms on subsequent duplications. 

[walt.farrell]

29 minutes ago, Lem3 said:

The only-takes-8-seconds way of doing that is just drag it with the pen/mouse. 

And that's the best way of doing it. But earlier you said you were using the arrow keys, and it was pointed out that that will not work. Using the Transform panel was only a suggestion to get around the problem with arrows, but if using the Transform panel I think it needs to be done differently than you tried.

I think this is the first you've said that when you drag to perform the transformation that the next Cmd/Ctrl+J doesn't transform properly. The sequence of actions needs to be precise: Duplicate a layer, transform the duplicate (keeping it selected in the Layers panel), then duplicate it again.

If you deselect that copy, or use the wrong transformation mechanism, the next duplication is not a "power duplicate".

 

[Lem3]

Walt,

the steps including transform with Drag were listed w-a-a-ay back near the top:

I seem to be hearing that people are following my steps precisely and getting different results.  That implies the issue is with my system or Photo installation, but I have two not very similar computers behaving the same way.

[iconoclast]

Just to exclude this: if you have tried a power duplication before and redone it for another try, so deselect the layer to end the first power duplication (important!), click on the layer again, press Ctrl+J then to duplicate it and do the transformation you want to the duplicate with the mouse or the transformation panel. Then press Ctrl+J again and again - but don't deselect the layer until you are ready with whatever you want to do with the power duplication.

[walt.farrell]

2 minutes ago, Lem3 said:

I seem to be hearing that people are following my steps precisely and getting different results.

No one (that I saw) said they followed your steps from the first post and got different results.

However, I missed a post from you awhile after that which said you had tried dragging, and that didn't work, either.

I may have now recreated what you're seeing. These steps will work, for me:

1. Start with a pixel layer.
2. Make a pixel selection using one of the marquee selection tools, or freehand selection.
3. Ctrl+J to duplicate the pixel selection on to a new pixel layer.
4. Select > Deselect to remove the marching ants.
5. Ctrl+J to duplicate the layer from 3 again.
6. Drag to move the layer from 5 to a different position.
7. Ctrl+J to duplicate the layer from 6, and it will be a power-duplicate, moving just the way you moved the layer from 5.

I suspect you are leaving out step 5. Step 5 is critical because if you simply drag the layer you got in step 3, that is not a transformation of the layer you started with in step 1. It is simply a "move" of the step 3 layer, not a transform of the step 1 layer.

[Lem3]

Walt,

Thank you for all your time on this.  I think we are saying the same thing in different ways: for some reason it requires three duplications of the base object to get power duplication to work.  That said, your steps don't work for me. My system requires an additional step:

2 hours ago, walt.farrell said:

I may have now recreated what you're seeing. These steps will work, for me:

1. Start with a pixel layer.
2. Make a pixel selection using one of the marquee selection tools, or freehand selection.
3. Ctrl+J to duplicate the pixel selection on to a new pixel layer.
4. Select > Deselect to remove the marching ants.
5. Transform the object in the new layer, dragging is fine.  Power duplicate will not happen without this step.
6. Ctrl+J to duplicate the layer from 3 again. This new layer is simply a duplicate, it will NOT reflect the Step 5 transform.
7. Drag to move the object from 6 to a different position.
8. Ctrl+J to duplicate the layer from 6, and it will be a power-duplicate, moving just the way you moved the object from 7.

If I don't make some transform on the object in the first duplicate layer power duplication fails in Step 8.

[walt.farrell]

18 minutes ago, Lem3 said:

I think we are saying the same thing in different ways: for some reason it requires three duplications of the base object to get power duplication to work.

I can consistently do it with two, not three, and without your step 5.

If that's confirmed by others, and isn't working for you, then if you can record a video that may be useful. It may be that you're doing something that we haven't understood from your descriptions so far. (I won't offer a video as I remain video-challenged. I need to work on that.)