Problem with Boolean Operations

[awakenedbyowls]

I'm trying to design a logo and keep everything neat and dimensioned, and the S in the logo is causing me problems. 

I started off drawing two S's and overlapping them, then I performed a Boolean operation and deleted some nodes to achieve the following shapes that make up the single shape I've trying to create (see first two images - I have separated the layers so you can see the two shapes I'm trying to add)

However, when I try to add them together (which should be a straightforward operation) I get the shape shown in the third image, which clearly isn't what I want. 

What am I doing wrong, or is it a bug?

Also, I want to adjust the angle of the shape and then shrink it down in the horizontal axis but when I select it I end up with an angled selection - how do I reformat the selection so that it's square?

Help.

[firstdefence]

You probably have open curves and or curves that need joining, without the file it's hard to tell.

[Alfred]

11 minutes ago, awakenedbyowls said:

What am I doing wrong, or is it a bug?

This looks like yet another example of the ongoing problems with Boolean operations, although it’s unusual to see issues with ‘Add’ rather than ‘Subtract’ or ‘Divide’. Try creating a Compound object (by holding down the Option/Alt key when you click on the ‘Add’ button on the toolbar).

To reset the bounding box shown in your last screenshot, select the object and perform a Boolean ‘Add’.

[awakenedbyowls]

All the curves are closed as far as I see. I found some extra nodes that didn't seem to fit the symmetry of what I did previously in the middle bit, so I deleted all the nodes in between the two points so that the hole in the large S shape overlapped the middle bit and added, which seemed to work better - but then it added an extra bit of curve inside the shape down near the bottom, so I just filled that bit in as well in the same way and then it all added together properly.

And it also automatically reset the boundary box that time.. 

I don't really understand how or why small imperfections seemed to creep in there and ruin my work flow. Maybe it was something I did, or maybe it's the software. 

As for unusual to have problems with add (you say) I was working with objects I previously performed subtractive Boolean operations on. One thing about Illustrator that I find works better is the ability to just click and delete sections in overlapping objects. 

[awakenedbyowls]

26 minutes ago, Alfred said:

To reset the bounding box shown in your last screenshot, select the object and perform a Boolean ‘Add’.

If I do that it also fills in the holes.

edit - however I managed to achieve a square boundary box by performing a series of Boolean operation where I added then used separate layers for the holes to subtract out the holes again, which seems like an awfully convoluted way of performing what should be a straightforward one-click operation???

 

[Alfred]

14 minutes ago, awakenedbyowls said:

If I do that it also fills in the holes.

edit - however I managed to achieve a square boundary box by performing a series of Boolean operation where I added then used separate layers for the holes to subtract out the holes again, which seems like an awfully convoluted way of performing what should be a straightforward one-click operation???

Well done! But yes, it should be much more straightforward.

[PixelPest]

I can´t help myself: ugly from scratch.

You might could have uploaded that portion here for detailed inspection though.

[awakenedbyowls]

57 minutes ago, PixelPest said:

I can´t help myself: ugly from scratch.

You might could have uploaded that portion here for detailed inspection though.

Not sure you are doing it the same way I did, in any case I can't remember now exactly what. This is essentially what I was working with when trying to Add the two layers.

I tried to recreate this the way I think I did it and I can't seem to recreate the initial S shapes I drew using the Pen tool, snapping to the grid and snapping the handles to one square every second node to create nice circular bends - now the edges have a slight kink in them.

Anyway, in trying to recreate my steps I now have a second design for the S which I am considering instead now anyway. 

S.afdesign

[PixelPest]

I don´t know why you have created 3 parts.

[awakenedbyowls]

27 minutes ago, PixelPest said:

I don´t know why you have created 3 parts.

There are only two layers in that file. The dark blue was created by some kind of subtractive Boolean, where the two original S shapes overlapped. I also use Boolean I think to get rid of the ends of the S's. And the original S I drew had a slight kink in it too, it wasn't a perfect circular curve. I'm trying to figure out how to draw a perfect circle using the pen tool.

[Alfred]

7 minutes ago, awakenedbyowls said:

I'm trying to figure out how to draw a perfect circle using the pen tool.

Is there a particular reason why you don’t want to use the Ellipse Tool for this?

[PixelPest]

You can put in 1 layer if you want - but it´s still built from 3 parts. What will happen when you use Boolean add on this 2 "S"-shapes?

[awakenedbyowls]

4 minutes ago, Alfred said:

Is there a particular reason why you don’t want to use the Ellipse Tool for this?

Same reason I learned how to do arithmetic in school before I used a calculator.

[awakenedbyowls]

Just now, PixelPest said:

You can put in 1 layer if you want - but it´s still built from 3 parts. What will happen when you use Boolean add on this 2 "S"-shapes?

Is there some logical reason why shapes in layers must be joined in order to be added as one layer?

[PixelPest]

"Layers" are just the term in Affinity what "objects" in other apps.

There are start and end points and "winding rules" which determines the direction of a path. Curves can also be merged. Joining is meant for continuous paths/strokes.

[Alfred]

25 minutes ago, awakenedbyowls said:

I'm trying to figure out how to draw a perfect circle using the pen tool.

 

17 minutes ago, Alfred said:

Is there a particular reason why you don’t want to use the Ellipse Tool for this?

 

11 minutes ago, awakenedbyowls said:

Same reason I learned how to do arithmetic in school before I used a calculator.

Come to think of it, even the Ellipse Tool won’t give you a perfect circle. Although you can achieve a good approximation, it isn’t mathematically possible to describe a perfect circle with Bézier curves.

[awakenedbyowls]

10 minutes ago, PixelPest said:

There are start and end points and "winding rules" which determines the direction of a path.

Not sure I follow. If I take that double SS and first perform a divide on it, then select only the parts I want and try to add them - they are all individual layers comprising one basic shape topology and they are all touching - why do I end up with this?

 

[PixelPest]

Why why why divide?

[awakenedbyowls]

6 minutes ago, Alfred said:

 

 

Come to think of it, even the Ellipse Tool won’t give you a perfect circle. Although you can achieve a good approximation, it isn’t mathematically possible to describe a perfect circle with Bézier curves.

I don't think the concept of a perfect circle exist anywhere in the universe (apart from in concept)

I'd like to know how to get close with the Bezzies anyway..

[Alfred]

6 minutes ago, awakenedbyowls said:

I don't think the concept of a perfect circle exist anywhere in the universe (apart from in concept)

I'd like to know how to get close with the Bezzies anyway..

Is this close enough for you?

 

[awakenedbyowls]

Just now, PixelPest said:

Why why why divide?

To separate the two shapes out into the relevant intersecting parts?

This is what Boolean operations are for right? 

How else would I achieve the end result I'm looking for. There is probably another way using interest and subtract on two variations of the overlapping SS's...

[awakenedbyowls]

2 minutes ago, Alfred said:

Is this close enough for you?

Can't really tell unless I can compare in AD with the circle feature. Any time I've tried I always get margins AND asymmetry. I guess ultimately it probably comes down to using many more nodes than just the four..

[PixelPest]

 

[Alfred]

7 minutes ago, awakenedbyowls said:

Can't really tell unless I can compare in AD with the circle feature.

Here ya go!

Bézier circle.afdesign

[PixelPest]

That´s the beauty of Spiro splines (Inkscape):