Publisher: Unwanted scaling of effects

[Failix]

Hi all,

I create a rectangle of 100 x 100 mm in Publisher. I fill the rectangle with a solid colour and give it a layer effect, e.g. a Gaussian Blur of exactly 50 px.

I create a second rectangle of 50 x 50 mm and fill it as well.

Now I copy the first, larger rectangle, click on the second, smaller rectangle and execute the command "Paste FX". The Gaussian Blur is transferred to the smaller rectangle, but its radius is only 22.8 px.

Now I can enlarge the smaller rectangle, but the radius remains at 22.9 px.

This makes absolutely no sense to me. Either effects are scaled or not, but what is it? I want an effect to just transfer as I created it, without scaling. Is that possible?

Regards,
Felix

[Pšenda]

This is a known issue (see numerous forum posts) that has been awaiting correction for several years.

[Failix]

Thank you for your answer! I'm sorry I didn't search before posting. And it's a pity that there is no solution.

Regards,
Felix

[Greyfox]

4 hours ago, Failix said:

Hi all,

I create a rectangle of 100 x 100 mm in Publisher. I fill the rectangle with a solid colour and give it a layer effect, e.g. a Gaussian Blur of exactly 50 px.

I create a second rectangle of 50 x 50 mm and fill it as well.

Now I copy the first, larger rectangle, click on the second, smaller rectangle and execute the command "Paste FX". The Gaussian Blur is transferred to the smaller rectangle, but its radius is only 22.8 px.

Now I can enlarge the smaller rectangle, but the radius remains at 22.9 px.

This makes absolutely no sense to me. Either effects are scaled or not, but what is it? I want an effect to just transfer as I created it, without scaling. Is that possible?

 

My results are different, perhaps because of an extra item

1. Create a 100mm x 100mm rectangle, and fill with solid color
2. Create a 50mm x 50mm rectangle and fill with a different solid color
3. Select the 100mm x 100mm rectangle and apply a Gaussian Blur layer effect set to 50px

4. Important - in the Layer Effects dialog, tick the "Scale with Object" box near the bottom left hand corner.

5. Copy the larger rectangle and then select the smaller rectangle and apply "Edit->Paste FX"

Now when I examine the layer effect for the smaller rectangle, the Gaussian Blur is 25%.

6. Use the Transform panel to increase the size of the small rectangle from 50mm x 50mm to 100mm x 100mm.

Now when I examine the layer effect for that rectangle, the Gaussian Blue if 50%.

That is doing what I would expect, it is scaling the layer effect with the object size.

[lepr]

1 minute ago, Greyfox said:

That is doing what I would expect, it is scaling the layer effect with the object size.

The problem (despite many years of recurring complaints) is the uncontrollable scaling of the effect when the effect is first pasted; the user should be able to prevent that initial scaling.

[Failix]

Sometimes it can be so simple. I did not notice the checkbox "Scale with Object".

It works as you describe - the only exception is that the small rectangle gets an effect of 25.4 instead of 25 %. After the enlargement it then has 50.7 %.But I can live with that, I think.

Many thanks and regards,
Felix

[Greyfox]

3 minutes ago, anon2 said:

The problem (despite many years of recurring complaints) is the uncontrollable scaling of the effect when the effect is first pasted; the user should be able to prevent that initial scaling.

Sorry, I don't understand that.  The original effect was 50px relative to a 100mm object, with the scale with object ticked.
When it pasted into the second rectangle, the size of the object had reduced by half (to 50mm), and the effect was scaled down by half (to 25px)
When the object was then resized to 100mm (doubled), the effect also doubled (back to 50px).

I don't see that as uncontrolled. 

 

 

[prophet]

7 minutes ago, Greyfox said:

When it pasted into the second rectangle, the size of the object had reduced by half (to 50mm), and the effect was scaled down by half (to 25px)

There is the problem. If I paste an effect from one object, I would like the same exact effect to be applied to the second. Instead, Affinity does some calculation and guesses what the effect should be scaled to with no input from the user.

[lepr]

8 minutes ago, Greyfox said:

Sorry, I don't understand that.  The original effect was 50px relative to a 100mm object, with the scale with object ticked.
When it pasted into the second rectangle, the size of the object had reduced by half (to 50mm), and the effect was scaled down by half (to 25px)
When the object was then resized to 100mm (doubled), the effect also doubled (back to 50px).

I don't see that as uncontrolled.

I wrote: "[...] the user should be able to prevent that initial scaling."

Being unable to prevent something is a lack of control.

[Greyfox]

5 minutes ago, Failix said:

It works as you describe - the only exception is that the small rectangle gets an effect of 25.4 instead of 25 %. After the enlargement it then has 50.7 %.But I can live with that, I think.

Strange. I used the Transform box to size both rectangles and In my case it was exactly 25px and then scaled back up to exactly 50px.

[Failix]

How embarrassing, now I have been completely misled. "If I paste an effect from one object, I would like the same exact effect to be applied to the second," wrote @prophet, which is what I meant. I guess I've been sitting at the computer too long today ...

[Greyfox]

1 minute ago, anon2 said:

I wrote: "[...] the user should be able to prevent that initial scaling."

Being unable to prevent something is a lack of control.

OK, I understand. If the Scale with object box is not ticked, you are saying the size of the effect should remain unchanged (not be scaled) when the size of the object is changed, and I agree with that.

And indeed, if the box is left un-ticked, then if the original box is resized, the effect does stay at the original size, but if it is copied to another object the size is changing.

[Pšenda]

3 hours ago, Greyfox said:

but if it is copied to another object the size is changing.

Imagine you have hundreds of objects / shapes of different sizes, and you tune fx (outer shadow, Emboss, 3D, ....) on one of them. Then you want to apply this effect to other objects, but you need the effect to have "exactly" the same parameters for all objects. However, with Paste fx, the effects change according to the size of the objects (in the ratio between the size of the original and the new object), and you must correct them all. Fortunately, you can select all objects in the Layer panel (while the fx form is displayed), and then the new fx parameter setting is set to all selected objects, so this is fixed only once.

[prophet]

8 minutes ago, Pšenda said:

Fortunately, you can select all objects in the Layer panel (while the fx form is displayed), and then the new fx parameter setting is set to all selected objects, so this is fixed only once.

This is not my experience. The FX do not apply just by selecting other objects. One has to "touch" a setting or slider to have it apply to all other objects. Maybe adjust a slider a bit or enter a new value. A bit of a workaround, but if there are multiple FX, one has to visit each one separately and "touch" them to get each to apply to all selected objects.

[Pšenda]

I thought that from my description it is clear, that the fx form will open first, then all objects in which fx needs to be set will be selected, and only then the necessary adjustment/correction of fx parameters will be made, according to the tuned one, which could not be the fault incorrectly functioning Paste fx transferred to other objects.

[Greyfox]

5 hours ago, prophet said:

 The FX do not apply just by selecting other objects. One has to "touch" a setting or slider to have it apply to all other objects. Maybe adjust a slider a bit or enter a new value. A bit of a workaround, but if there are multiple FX, one has to visit each one separately and "touch" them to get each to apply to all selected objects.

@prophet, @Pšenda

My experience is that touching one slider in a layer effect isn't enough to have the whole layer effect applied to the selected objects.

1. Draw two circles the same diameter, say 100mm. (or draw one and make a copy). Fill color one red and one yellow.
2. Select the red one, open the layer effects panel, select 3D, then change Radius to 100px and Specular to 100%
3. Leaving the layer effects panel open, now select both the red and yellow circles. Note at this stage no effect has been applied to the yellow circle.
4. Change the 3D radius from 100px back to 90px, then back up to 100px. Note that the 3D effect has been applied to the yellow circle.
5. Deselect both circles, then individually select them and check the two 3D slider values.

What I'm finding is that whilst the radius is 100px on both, the specular on the red is 100%, and on the yellow its 50%.

It seems to me I would have to touch every individual slider that had been changed from its default setting, or am I missing something?

[prophet]

On 4/2/2021 at 7:08 PM, Greyfox said:

It seems to me I would have to touch every individual slider that had been changed from its default setting, or am I missing something?

Indeed, that seems to be the case. Workable in the short run, but perhaps a pain if one is returning to an effect that was set some time ago and one doesn't remember all of the finer details of which settings were set to what value.

Even more complicated if you select 2 objects with the same effects applied, but with different values. In your example, if I select both circles, the effects panel shows the specular value of the first object selected instead of indicating there is a mismatch between the 2 values. See my similar complaint which as not been addressed as of 1.9.2