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PUBLISHER cannot get Update in the Index panel to worK


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I am a relative beginner in that I have learned Publisher from scratch and never used DTP apps before. Fingers crossed I am doing fine. I have been building a project for about a year now and am delighted with results. I think this is an amazing app.

But obviously I do misunderstand new stuff sometimes so I am guessing that I am missing something I need to be doing here.

I am having problems with the Index panel. I have just started adding an index to the end of a large document. I have set some index markers in the text and created a page with a text frame for the index. The Index panel shows the marked items in a list below it and clicking the Insert Index button creates an index in my selected text frame. It works perfectly! 

Except ....... if I modify the marker list by adding and/or removing markers then select the index text frame and click the Update button in the Index panel, nothing happens. I have tried everything I can think of but I cannot get my index to update. I have a workaround, which is to select everything in the existing index and delete it, then click Insert Index and it creates a new index with all the changes. Obviously this less than ideal, but I haven't been able to find any way of getting the Update button to work.

Suggestions anyone please?   

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  • 5 weeks later...

Same is happening to me. Bug, I think. The only thing that works is highlighting all the text, cutting it, and then clicking "insert index" so that it starts anew. Not exactly a workflow to make you feel comfortable.

In other words, I think that feature is temporarily under the weather. Makes no sense otherwise.

Clearing a Path to Joy (And finding contentment along the way) — (artwork and typesetting courtesy of Affinity apps).

Reality Checks for Everyday Life     —   (My "book of better questions," done in APub)

www.rolandk.ca — "Relentless adventures in self-expression"

[All 3 Affinity Apps on a Power Mac & PC (Sierra/Mohave/Win 10]

 

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Given that my query has gone unattended for five weeks I wouldn't hold your breath waiting for a response. Affinity team are normally very responsive and helpful, one of the best for that, but they are overloaded at present.

Looks like workarounds for now. 🤔

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Damn it, where are my opiates when I need them? :D

Clearing a Path to Joy (And finding contentment along the way) — (artwork and typesetting courtesy of Affinity apps).

Reality Checks for Everyday Life     —   (My "book of better questions," done in APub)

www.rolandk.ca — "Relentless adventures in self-expression"

[All 3 Affinity Apps on a Power Mac & PC (Sierra/Mohave/Win 10]

 

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  • 4 weeks later...
  • Moderators

@DavidMac

Sorry for the delay replying to this thread, back in march we were inundated and it seems some posts like yours were missed, for which I apologise.

We believe this is due to the text frame being on  master page - We've logged an issue for that, and the work around for readers of this thread is to place a text frame for your index on the page not the master page for now

Patrick Connor
Serif Europe Ltd

"There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man. True nobility lies in being superior to your previous self."  W. L. Sheldon

 

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Thanks Patrick. The last months have been topsy turvy for all of us, no matter where. Affinity forums are some of the most responsive on the web, particularly where the developers responding themselves is concerned. No apologies needed. I'll try what you suggest. Thanks. 

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Update is now working for me using master pages without a main content text frame. I add the frame and then shift click the red triangle and it populates the other pages with text frames. A small miracle of efficiency. :)

Clearing a Path to Joy (And finding contentment along the way) — (artwork and typesetting courtesy of Affinity apps).

Reality Checks for Everyday Life     —   (My "book of better questions," done in APub)

www.rolandk.ca — "Relentless adventures in self-expression"

[All 3 Affinity Apps on a Power Mac & PC (Sierra/Mohave/Win 10]

 

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  • 1 year later...
On 5/27/2021 at 5:15 PM, Patrick Connor said:

@DavidMac

Sorry for the delay replying to this thread, back in march we were inundated and it seems some posts like yours were missed, for which I apologise.

We believe this is due to the text frame being on  master page - We've logged an issue for that, and the work around for readers of this thread is to place a text frame for your index on the page not the master page for now

Unfortunately this does not work.  I have Master Pages for an Index with NO text frames - but I still can't add an index to the document. The first attempt stopped updating.

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1 hour ago, Dennison said:

Unfortunately this does not work.  I have Master Pages for an Index with NO text frames - but I still can't add an index to the document. The first attempt stopped updating.

I don't think the issue with updating an index which is in a master page's text frame is related to your issue with adding an index. I think I wrote this in another thread but there has to be a stray index character somewhere in the document for Publisher to think it already has an index. Publisher makes it too easy for this situation to arise because it doesn't highlight the index copy. Here are two options to find that pesky index character(s):

First, try to update the hidden index. Turn on View > Show Text Flow so you can see the borders of all text frames. Then add a new index mark with some text that is not in your book, such as ASDF, and update the index which should insert the word ASDF into the index's text frame. Then search for ASDF with Find and click the result to go to that page. It's possible the text frame will be on the artboard but with Show Text Flow enabled you should still be able to see it and the layer should be selected. If you don't see it, zoom way out and look for a selected object - the text frame might have been accidentally reduced to zero width and height but if that happened after using Find it should be selected with a couple of size handles, the rotation handle, and an overset indicator.

Second, and I think this is what I suggested before, divide the document to find it. Back up the document first. If the document is divided up into separate multiple stories (series of linked frames), delete all the pages in the first story and then try to add an index. If that doesn't solve it delete the second story and try again. Repeat and eventually you should figure out which pages/stories have the problem. if the document is all in one story with just some extra frames for front and back matter, try deleting all of its text first to find out if the stray index character is buried within it. If that's not it then it's obviously not in the major story so then use the same technique as above, delete half the pages and see if you can now insert an index and if that doesn't work undo that and delete the other half. Repeat until you figure out which page it's on.

Cheers

Affinity Publisher/Designer/Photo 2 for macOS Ventura 13.0, MacBook Pro 14" (M1 Pro)

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okay thanks Mike.  I will give it a go.  I appreciate your suggestions and trying to help.

There are THOUSANDS of text frames - it's value-added logbook of 200+ pages - so dividing up the file might be a multi-day job.

I still believe there is a BUG.  I work very carefully and have 1000s of hours on AfPub. I created two linked text frames for the TOC.  I created two linked text frames with 2 columns in each for the Index.  There are 200 pages in between these text frames.

Insert TOC

Later inserted Index.  Index appears.

As soon as it is updated - the TOC at the front of the book is replaced by the Index. The Index at the back of the book is frozen.  When ALL these new text frames are deleted - and new text frames created, no index can be inserted.  Master page setup was never touched. The Master page settings for the TOC and the Index pages were removed and then re-added.

This has happened on EVERY publication I've worked on using AfPub so I don't believe I've made a stray error.  

After THREE years of users requesting either a solution to this bug or a way to find the errant blank index, it's about time for some action by the developers.

thanks,

Dennison

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I agree that it's too easy to "lose" your index and too hard to find it after you've lost it. If/when scripting support is added I'll write a script to find the index if the API provides that support. That should be a very short script.

Affinity Publisher/Designer/Photo 2 for macOS Ventura 13.0, MacBook Pro 14" (M1 Pro)

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Thanks Mike.  I hope a workable workaround comes soon.

After three years I'm tired of waiting and will likely switch back to InDesign, which is sad after 5000-6000 hours on AfPub.

 

The more I think about this, the more I'm convinced that it is a bug and not operator error.

1) I  add index markers in the text of the document

2) I insert an index.

3) I update the index. Nothing happens

4) The TOC at the front of the book has been replaced by the Index - so the book now has two indices.

5) I delete all text frames with TOC and Index at the back are deleted.

6) New text frame. Cannot insert Index because a second hidden index still exists - but how was it created?

If there is already an index in the book - which I see and edit with the Index Panel - how can the software be adding a second index? It is this hidden 2nd index which apparently remains after the visible index is deleted. and which is stopping a new index from being inserted. The operator cannot insert a second index, so how is the second index being created, except by software error?

Why, when I'm editing using the Index panel and can see the index in the text frames at the back of the book, does "update index" cause the TOC at the front of the book to be replaced by the Index. The operator cannot create two indices, but I documented months ago a book with two indices.

 

Other topic - any work around yet for the failure of characters to work from the Apple Emoji & Symbols table.  When Ω or µ are inserted, the text exports in pdf as ☐

Thanks,

Dennison

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I've followed up on your suggestions:

1) no errant text frames on the Artboard.

2) Am I not understanding what an "index character" is?  I am using FaR cog wheel to search all displayed styles with the word "Index":

Character Styles:

Index Cross-Reference

Index Cross-Reference Topic

Index Entry Page Number

and

Paragraph Styles:

Index

Index Entry 1

Index Entry 19

Index Entry 2

-- ALL "No Results Found"

 

3) Combined Paragraph Style "Index" with Character "No Style"

results in long list.

clicked first entry - Show in Document.

Immediately the existing TOC (see screenshot) is replaced by the Index (see screenshot).

What is going on?  I do not believe I am making accidental errors.

The Index replacing the TOC has happened in several documents.  How is that even possible?

 

Thanks.  Any suggestions and clarification welcome.

Search term TOC replaced.jpg

Index denied.jpg

TOC.jpg

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Similar problem - different file - clearer example

3 screenshots:

1) Index displayed - does not update - see screenshot

2) as per Forum workaround, delete Index (and text frames deleted) - see screenshot

3) new index denied - see screenshot

 

Clearly, if there is an index visible, then there cannot be another manually inserted index in the document at the same time because it would have be denied when the user tried to insert. My supposition is that it is being created by the app (ie. a bug).

Index Denied2.jpg

Index + Txt Frames deleted.jpg

No update.jpg

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I now seem to have the Indexing working again.

My bad - I did not understand that the presence or absence of an Index is defined by any Text Style with the word "Index" in it - ie. any Character Style or Paragraph Style. There is no special marker for an index.  An Index does not need to be Inserted for the app to decide that an empty Text Frame already is an index - and hence block attempts to insert an Index. Any empty text frame with "Index" in its style name will be counted as an index.

My mistake. This is not a Bug. 

But it does seem a rather curious design because there is no limit to how many Text Frames can be created with an "Index style", even if the document already has an index that has been manually inserted.  ie. Adding a Text Frame with an Index Style will not be denied even though it is counted by the app as an index if the manually inserted index is deleted.  This breaks the app's rule only allowing a single index.

Apologies that I'm not being clearer.

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I'm glad you got it working again but this is incorrect. A text frame formatted with an Index style will not prevent the insertion of an index. Nor will typing text formatted with an Index style. Here's a test that proves this is not the case:

  1. I created a doc and added 2 text frames
  2. I inserted an index marker into #1 and an index into #2
  3. I clicked in the index and then drew a third text frame so this one had its default formatting set to the Index paragraph style. I tried this test with a blank frame and also after typing some text formatted as Index.
  4. I selected and then deleted the index in #2 and for good measure typed some text, selected all, and set it to Body.
  5. I then inserted an index into #2 without issues

I repeated this test with every Index style - having text frames with their default formatting set to an Index style or having text formatted as an Index style has no bearing on whether or not a new index can be inserted. The issue is with having a remnant of the original index.

I did a few tests just now to learn more about how Publisher determines whether an index is present. Using this example:

BEFORE¶
My first index entry   1¶
My second index entry   2¶
AFTER¶

  • You can edit the special index text but updating it will replaced your edits of course.
  • If I format "AFTER" as Index Entry + Index Entry Page Number so it matches the formatting of "2" above it and then update the index, that line of text will not be replaced.
  • If I press Return before the "2" in the second entry and add more text or paragraphs they will be replaced when updating the index.
  • If I select the first character (M) of "My second...", format it as Body and then update the index, I'll have truncated the index. Publisher will now believe the index starts with "My first..." and ends with "1". From "My second..." to the end of index will now be regular text that just happens to be formatted as an index.
  • One really important thing to note is that inserting an index doesn't insert a paragraph return before the index. If you did this:

    BEFORE<insert index here>¶
    AFTER¶

It will not be an index but just a block of text formatted as an index. If you want to be able to update it after inserting it, you must insert it at the start of a new paragraph.

  • If you place the cursor before "My first" and backspace up so that you have "BEFOREMy first...", you'll still have an updatable index but you'll have messed things up. Updating the index will now result in this:

    BEFOREMy first index entry   1¶
    My first index entry   1¶
    My second index entry   2¶
    AFTER¶

    The first "My first..." is the original one that became regular text while the second instance of it is the new updated index.

The moral of the story to avoid problems?

  1. Place the index frame on a regular page if you want to be able to update it via the Index panel - if you don't mind using Preflight go ahead and put the frame on a master
  2. Always insert an index into an empty text frame

Affinity Publisher/Designer/Photo 2 for macOS Ventura 13.0, MacBook Pro 14" (M1 Pro)

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THANK YOU MIKE.  I really appreciate you taking the time to check and explain.

I will go through each step of your trials.

To be clear:

1) I have ONLY ever placed a Text Frame that will contain an Index on a regular page; never a Master page.

2) I have ONLY ever inserted or attempted to insert an index into an empty text frame

3) When I Searched for every Paragraph Style with "Index" and changed the Text Style manually in every text frame found, all the index problems disappeared.

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8 hours ago, Dennison said:

3) When I Searched for every Paragraph Style with "Index" and changed the Text Style manually in every text frame found, all the index problems disappeared.

This sounds nasty. It would be so easy to assign an Index text style to some little element somewhere, inadvertently or on purpose. I will keep this (bug) in mind. Or at least try to remember it.

Mac Pro (Late 2013) Mac OS 11.7.1 
Affinity Designer 2.0.0 | Affinity Photo 2.0.0 | Affinity Publisher 2.0.0 | Beta versions as they appear.

I have never mastered color management, period, so I cannot help with that.

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