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With more than 293,000 threads in the Affinity for Windows forum, why are there no sub-forums for Designer, Photo, and Publisher.

I'm a member of DPReview, and it would be like them bunching all the camera makers into one forum.

If seperated, it would make it easier to use, since keywords are similar between programs and you need to sift thru the posts that don't pertain to you. If there is a separate way to search, then I haven't found it, PLUS it adds to the difficulty of searching.

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There are specific forums for bug reports, and for feature requests, and for beta discussions. And separate forums for iPad vs Mac/Windows, as the iPad versions of the applications are significantly different from the desktop versions.

But for questions, please consider that all 3 applications share a lot of infrastructure. Rectangles work the same in all 3, for example. So if someone using Photo asks a question about how Rectangles work, the answer is completely applicable to Designer and Publisher, too. The same is true for the many other tools and generality this commonality means that many questions asked about one of the applications are equally useful for the others.

That means that we do not need, usually, 3 separate conversations about how some function works. Or 6, if we were then to say "why not split Mac and Windows, too."

If all the cameral makers cameras worked the same way, it might make sense for DPReview to have a single forum, too. But they don't work the same, and so separate forums make sense.

Note: This is an area with some significant disagreement among the users on the Affinity forums. So far, Serif seems to agree with the viewpoint I've expressed here.

And sometimes more clarification is needed, because sometimes there are functions that work differently between the applications, or between Windows and Mac. But more often, the distinction is not needed.

 

-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 20H2 (19042.685),
   Desktop: 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00GHz, GeForce GTX 970
   Laptop (2021-04-06):  32GB memory, Intel Core i7-10750H @ 2.60GHz
, Intel UHD Graphics Comet Lake GT2 and NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Laptop GPU
Affinity Photo 1.9.2.1035 and 1.9.4.1065 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.9.2.1035 and 1.9.4.1065 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.9.2.1035 and 1.9.2.1024 Beta

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So if there is "significant disagreement", then Serif is intentionally not listening to it's own user base? Something else that makes me go "hmmmm..."

Guess we'll just have to struggle along, slightly hobbled of course. Sorry if this sounds harsh but I tend to think there is always a better way.

 

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23 minutes ago, BARBAKANE said:

So if there is "significant disagreement", then Serif is intentionally not listening to it's own user base? Something else that makes me go "hmmmm..."

No - the "significant disagreement" just means that there's a wide diversity of opinions.  The idea that the user base is in one camp while Serif is in the other is completely wrong!  It's a subject that's been discussed at length in this forum, but I'll leave it to you to decide if there's a majority opinion.

AP, AD & APub user, running Win10

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38 minutes ago, BARBAKANE said:

Guess we'll just have to struggle along, slightly hobbled of course.

I do not think we're hobbled at all. I believe the current organization is quite reasonable.

I did not say there was disagreement between the users and Serif; I said there was disagreement among the users. Many of us recognize the usefulness of the current arrangement.

-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 20H2 (19042.685),
   Desktop: 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00GHz, GeForce GTX 970
   Laptop (2021-04-06):  32GB memory, Intel Core i7-10750H @ 2.60GHz
, Intel UHD Graphics Comet Lake GT2 and NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Laptop GPU
Affinity Photo 1.9.2.1035 and 1.9.4.1065 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.9.2.1035 and 1.9.4.1065 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.9.2.1035 and 1.9.2.1024 Beta

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15 hours ago, Xzenor said:

I wouldn't mind a mandatory tag to specify what application the question is about but separating them in sub-forums seems unnecessary.

It was requested a long time ago, and unfortunately Serif did not respond.

 

Affinity Store: Affinity Suite (ADe, APh, APu) 1.8.5.703.
Windows 10 Pro, Version 20H2, Build 19042.610.
Dell Latitude E5570, i5-6440HQ 2.60 GHz, 8 GB, Intel HD Graphics 530, 1920 x 1080.
Dell OptiPlex 7060, i5-8500 3.00 GHz, 16 GB, Intel UHD Graphics 630, Dell P2417H 1920 x 1080.
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The forum software is an off-the-shelf product, not something of Serif's creation. Serif has requested some changes in this software (I can't remember what), but I have heard of no response. The upshot is that adding mandatory tags is not possible in the current version of the forum software. I would guess that splitting a forum would be possible, but Serif have chosen not to for the reasons that @walt.farrell explained.

Personally, I would favour a split.

John

Windows 10, Affinity Photo 1.9.2 Designer 1.9.2 and Publisher 1.9.2 (mainly Photo), now ex-Adobe CC

CPU: AMD A6-3670. RAM: 16 GB DDR3 @ 666MHz, Graphics: 2047MB NVIDIA GeForce GT 630

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4 hours ago, John Rostron said:

The upshot is that adding mandatory tags is not possible in the current version of the forum software.

Even if it was possible, how would that work?

As has been mentioned many times in every discussion about this, many if not most app features are not specific to any one Affinity app -- for example, questions about using the Layers or Color panels, using quick shapes, customizing the main toolbar, showing/hiding the context toolbar, restoring factory defaults, etc. apply equally well to all 3 desktop apps.

So at the least there should be an "all/any app" tag of some sort, but since many users won't know anything about the Affinity apps they don't use/own, they are most likely to pick the tag for the one app they are using. So users searching for topics about any of the many features common to all the apps could not just limit themselves to topics with an AP, AD, or APub tag.

Affinity Photo 1.9.3, Affinity Designer 1.9.3, Affinity Publisher 1.9.3;  2020 iMac 27"; 3.8GHz i7, Radeon Pro 5700, 32GB RAM; macOS 10.15.7
Affinity Photo 
1.92.236 & Affinity Designer 1.9.2 (showing 1.9.9) for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iPadOS 14.4 (18D52)

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1 hour ago, R C-R said:

So at the least there should be an "all/any app" tag

And is that a problem? Already today, the requirements forum is divided for individual applications (APh, ADe, APh) and ASuite.

In the many discussions you have mentioned, the meaning of mandatory/non-mandatory/indicative Tags has been repeatedly explained to you, and only you repeatedly do not understand them. But all the discussions are completely useless, because Serif did nothing at all in three years, despite promising a solution. If Serif's lack of interest in the needs of forum users causes experienced users to lose interest in reading and contributing to the forum, then he will have no one to answer questions. 

Affinity Store: Affinity Suite (ADe, APh, APu) 1.8.5.703.
Windows 10 Pro, Version 20H2, Build 19042.610.
Dell Latitude E5570, i5-6440HQ 2.60 GHz, 8 GB, Intel HD Graphics 530, 1920 x 1080.
Dell OptiPlex 7060, i5-8500 3.00 GHz, 16 GB, Intel UHD Graphics 630, Dell P2417H 1920 x 1080.
Intel NUC5PGYH, Pentium N3700 2.40 GHz, 8 GB, Intel HD Graphics, EIZO EV2456 1920 x 1200.

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3 minutes ago, Pšenda said:

And is that a problem?

Yes, because there is there is no way to make sure each topic that concerns a feature present in all the apps will be tagged with the 'all apps' tag rather than the tag for one or another of the apps. That is because many users of just one of the apps do not know that many features are also present in the others ... or for that matter even that there are 3 different Affinity apps.

IOW, you cannot assume that a user starting a topic will know enough to use the right tag. 

27 minutes ago, Pšenda said:

Already today, the requirements forum is divided for individual applications (APh, ADe, APh) and ASuite.

What 'requirements forum' do you mean?

30 minutes ago, Pšenda said:

In the many discussions you have mentioned, the meaning of mandatory/non-mandatory/indicative Tags has been repeatedly explained to you, and only you repeatedly do not understand them.

If we are talking about mandatory tags, I assume this means a user starting a topic (the OP) must choose from a precompiled list of tags in order to post the topic. That is a problem if that user does not know which of those tags should be used because (as is all too common in other support forums like Apple's) it is likely they will just pick the first item on the list or decide not to post anything at all for fear of getting it wrong.

That in turn means users cannot rely on these tags to see which app(s) a question applies to or which topics include the best answers to them.

Then of course, there is the additional complication of different tags for the Mac & Windows versions, which some users have suggested, so it just does not seem like something that would improve anything.

Affinity Photo 1.9.3, Affinity Designer 1.9.3, Affinity Publisher 1.9.3;  2020 iMac 27"; 3.8GHz i7, Radeon Pro 5700, 32GB RAM; macOS 10.15.7
Affinity Photo 
1.92.236 & Affinity Designer 1.9.2 (showing 1.9.9) for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iPadOS 14.4 (18D52)

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@Pšenda, basically what I am saying is since this is a product support forum nothing should make its use more difficult for the least knowledgeable users (& potential users) than for more knowledgeable users.

Forcing someone with little or no knowledge of the apps to choose from a list of mandatory tags to start a topic does that, & as a "bonus" makes it easier for anyone relying on these tags to miss topics with useful info because they may not be tagged properly.

P.S. Still puzzled about what you mean by a "requirements forum" or any forum with an "ASuite" division.

Affinity Photo 1.9.3, Affinity Designer 1.9.3, Affinity Publisher 1.9.3;  2020 iMac 27"; 3.8GHz i7, Radeon Pro 5700, 32GB RAM; macOS 10.15.7
Affinity Photo 
1.92.236 & Affinity Designer 1.9.2 (showing 1.9.9) for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iPadOS 14.4 (18D52)

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7 minutes ago, R C-R said:

P.S. Still puzzled about what you mean by a "requirements forum" or any forum with an "ASuite" division.

It doesn't bother you with that - unfortunately you obviously don't have on it. Finding the "Feature Requests & Suggestions" forum, ie a forum for user requirements, is simply beyond your skills.

 

12 minutes ago, R C-R said:

list of mandatory tags

It is interesting, that even though it is repeatedly explained to you, that the tags are only indicative, so that the OP knows what is appropriate and necessary to include in the topic as additional information, you are constantly catching the word "mandatory".

Affinity Store: Affinity Suite (ADe, APh, APu) 1.8.5.703.
Windows 10 Pro, Version 20H2, Build 19042.610.
Dell Latitude E5570, i5-6440HQ 2.60 GHz, 8 GB, Intel HD Graphics 530, 1920 x 1080.
Dell OptiPlex 7060, i5-8500 3.00 GHz, 16 GB, Intel UHD Graphics 630, Dell P2417H 1920 x 1080.
Intel NUC5PGYH, Pentium N3700 2.40 GHz, 8 GB, Intel HD Graphics, EIZO EV2456 1920 x 1200.

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36 minutes ago, R C-R said:

Forcing someone with little or no knowledge of the apps to choose from a list of mandatory tags to start a topic does that, & as a "bonus" makes it easier for anyone relying on these tags to miss topics with useful info because they may not be tagged properly.

Can't be worser than it actually is ...

  • Postings of users without naming which Affinity apps they use or mean at all.
  • Also they often don't tell the OS they are working on with the related Affinity app, which makes a huge difference due to bugs etc.
  • Postings into wrong categories, for example iPads have their own category, common questions in resources or tuts etc.
  • People who try to help do often waste their time, since they have first to ask after some of the above listed points in order to give then the right advice. Or they have to recherche what a specific user who asked something might be using and meaning at all here (app & platform & version etc.).
4 hours ago, R C-R said:

As has been mentioned many times in every discussion about this, many if not most app features are not specific to any one Affinity app -- for example, questions about using the Layers or Color panels, using quick shapes, customizing the main toolbar, showing/hiding the context toolbar, restoring factory defaults, etc. apply equally well to all 3 desktop apps.

LOL - I can also easily argue against that, when looking at the actual 1.9.0 versions & betas, which partly behave & core completely differently here on certain of these and other aspects.

☛ Affinity Designer 1.9.3 ◆ Affinity Photo 1.9.3 ◆ OSX El Capitan

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58 minutes ago, Pšenda said:

 Finding the "Feature Requests & Suggestions" forum, ie a forum for user requirements, is simply beyond your skills.

Nope. It is just that it is not in any meaningful sense to me a "requirements forum" so I had no idea what you were talking about. That is why I asked for more info (just as I have suggested in the last paragraph below).

57 minutes ago, v_kyr said:

Can't be worse than it actually is ...

Sure it can. You are thinking about it from the standpoint of a knowledgeable user. Think about it instead from the standpoint of someone new to both the forums & to the Affinity apps, possibly someone with zero experience with any of them or graphics software in general, or maybe someone not even aware that Serif makes 3 different Affinity apps for 3 different operating systems, & sells them through 4 different stores.

So just picking the appropriate tag or (sub)category, particularly if there are separate ones for the OS or app & maybe even for the store, can be so error prone that if you assume an OP got it right, you could waste a lot of time before figuring out that it isn't the correct advice for the app, OS, store version, or whatever.

Then of course like @walt.farrell mentioned there are all the topics where none of that matters because so many features work exactly or almost exactly the same across all versions & platforms. Making every OP choose a category or tag implies that this is not true, contributing to the problem we already have with the duplication of so many topics asking the same questions over & over that have been answered so many times before, which is yet another massive waste of time.

Bottom line: when the OS, app, etc. matters & it isn't clear from the context, ask about it or let someone else do so.

Affinity Photo 1.9.3, Affinity Designer 1.9.3, Affinity Publisher 1.9.3;  2020 iMac 27"; 3.8GHz i7, Radeon Pro 5700, 32GB RAM; macOS 10.15.7
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Top Line: If the operating system, app, etc. are important (and most of the time they are), let a user select an appropriate category first so that you don't always have to ask for it explicitly!

☛ Affinity Designer 1.9.3 ◆ Affinity Photo 1.9.3 ◆ OSX El Capitan

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5 minutes ago, v_kyr said:

Top Line: If the operating system, app, etc. are important (and most of the time they are), let a user select an appropriate category first so that you don't always have to ask for it explicitly!

Why do you assume an OP -- particularly one new to the software & in most need of help & guidance from a product support forum -- can correctly pick an appropriate category to begin with?

Affinity Photo 1.9.3, Affinity Designer 1.9.3, Affinity Publisher 1.9.3;  2020 iMac 27"; 3.8GHz i7, Radeon Pro 5700, 32GB RAM; macOS 10.15.7
Affinity Photo 
1.92.236 & Affinity Designer 1.9.2 (showing 1.9.9) for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iPadOS 14.4 (18D52)

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5 hours ago, R C-R said:

Why do you assume an OP -- particularly one new to the software & in most need of help & guidance from a product support forum -- can correctly pick an appropriate category to begin with?

Well, I figured it out when I was a newbie. Others do as well.

 It's not exactly rocket science.

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I think filling a signature in helps a lot, having "at a glance" details can kill a multitude of investigative questions prior to giving help on the actual question; which can be cryptic at times. It baffles me how many people post their name or email as a post title nullifying most search capabilities later on.

A few subtle hints for making posts.
image.png.6e9b338eadbc8541f8e41625850a826b.png

 

iMac 27" Late 2015 Fully Loaded, iMac 27" Mid 2011 both running High Sierra 10.13.6 - Affinity Designer/Photo & Publisher - Illustrator CC, Inkscape, Blender, Sketchup, Pepakura Designer, MTC, Pixelmator & Pixelmator Pro + more... XP-Pen Artist-22E, - iPad Pro 12.9 B|  

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10 hours ago, R C-R said:

Why do you assume an OP -- particularly one new to the software & in most need of help & guidance from a product support forum -- can correctly pick an appropriate category to begin with?

Forums always do need a well organized content structure for several obvious reasons and an essentiell part of this is here the correct sorting in and referencing of content and topics. This increases the generell overview, makes it easier to find and search for specific topics and also enhances and helps to use it overall as a supporting platform. A forum ideally leads here itself on how to use it. - Thus users have to adapt to those forum structures and rules, pretty much the same as first time using and learning some new software or the like.

Further people who bought and start to use a software, usually know what they bought and for what individual purpose, also on which platform they tend to use it. Shouldn't be rocket science to see what the software about panel tells what and which software it is at all here. - So if you learned and can do that, other people can too, in the same manner as they have to learn how to use or make their use out of any of the Affinity products!

 

☛ Affinity Designer 1.9.3 ◆ Affinity Photo 1.9.3 ◆ OSX El Capitan

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True believer that tags help but solution, IMHO, is separate AP forum by applications.  Many will think we are not entitled to our own. The same response, from the same have and always been against any change.  So this is suck it up post, not going to happen.  If this was such a bad suggestion, the iPad forum would not be separated by applications.  Serif managed to achieve that, so I don’t understand why it’s a problem.  It is true that  individuals can learn form many post that touch on similar operations across platforms.  I just see it as a customer request to allow user to subscribe to their AP application or applications of their interest.  As is, I scroll through 90% or more questions without reading. My choice, many see it as my lost.  Your opinion, my opinion, really not a point of discussion, just a statement on my part.
 

Cecil 

iMac Retina 5K, 27”, 2019. 3.6 GHz Intel Core 9, 40 GB Memory DDR4, Radeon Pro 580X 8 GB, macOS,iPad Pro iPadOS

 

Continuous improvement is better than delayed perfection 

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11 hours ago, R C-R said:

Why do you assume an OP -- particularly one new to the software & in most need of help & guidance from a product support forum -- can correctly pick an appropriate category to begin with?

This statement is disturbing, where you seem to be insinuating the people that come here for help are ignorant and/or incompetent.  It also lends itself to arrogance. Some, very few from what I've seen, really are computer illiterate. Nowadays, most are computer literate, just don't fully understand the program(s).

Why do we assume? Because we ask when it's not posted, and they tell us what software they're using. So based on just that, yes they can choose the appropriate category.

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In my very humble opinion, @firstdefence has the compromise solution that is 1) easy to implement; 2) clear as a bell;  3) not patronizing to those new members who could very easily NOT be as computer literate as people born since the 1990’s or who have ingrained procedures from years of using other softwares; and 4) not a waste of time for very experienced users who are trying to help.  “It takes all kinds to make a world,” and one of the comments one sees every so often is that the wonderful video tutorials assume more knowledge on the part of the viewer than is actually there.  Surely the written forums should be a place where new users are not equally unsure where their questions belong.   After all, isn’t the ultimate goal to see that Affinity users are up to speed with, and very happy about, their move to Affinity?

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7 hours ago, firstdefence said:

I think filling a signature in helps a lot, having "at a glance" details can kill a multitude of investigative questions prior to giving help on the actual question; which can be cryptic at times. It baffles me how many people post their name or email as a post title nullifying most search capabilities later on.

A few subtle hints for making posts.
image.png.6e9b338eadbc8541f8e41625850a826b.png

This is great but very few will see it unless accidentally come across it.  But is very informative and to the point. I still prefer separating applications as they do for iPad.

 

Cecil 

iMac Retina 5K, 27”, 2019. 3.6 GHz Intel Core 9, 40 GB Memory DDR4, Radeon Pro 580X 8 GB, macOS,iPad Pro iPadOS

 

Continuous improvement is better than delayed perfection 

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6 hours ago, Ron P. said:

This statement is disturbing, where you seem to be insinuating the people that come here for help are ignorant and/or incompetent. 

What I am saying is that for various reasons some people lack sufficient knowledge to choose an appropriate tag or category. That does not make them incompetent, just more in need of the kind of help this forum is intended to provide than for those with more knowledge of the Affinity and/or other graphic apps, the differing requirements for various OSes, etc.

Please keep in mind that includes people who have no prior experience with any of the Affinity apps who come here looking for help deciding if they should purchase one or more of them. It also includes people struggling with language barriers, those with very little technical expertise of any kind, & those who rarely if ever have posted anything to a product support forum in the past.

Basically, what I am saying is the purpose of the forum is first & foremost to offer help to those who most need it. I am opposed to anything that does not meet that standard.

Affinity Photo 1.9.3, Affinity Designer 1.9.3, Affinity Publisher 1.9.3;  2020 iMac 27"; 3.8GHz i7, Radeon Pro 5700, 32GB RAM; macOS 10.15.7
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