Publisher Softproof many Pages

[max3.2]

Hi,

as simple as the title - need to Softproof a final document with many pages. I can only find the adjustment layer which is tedious. Any way to work with the whole document?

Is exporting with applied profile an option? This should give me jpegs which look proofed (at least for checking,..)

Best

[Lee D]

Try creating a new master page, name it Soft Proof for easy reference. Now add a Soft Proof adjustment layer to the master page using the profile you want to export to. Now apply that master page to any others you may have which if setup will also apply to the other pages. Remember to delete or disable this master page before exporting.

As you already know, you can apply the colour profile when exporting to PDF and then compare the results. If needed make adjustments in Publisher before exporting again.

[walt.farrell]

8 minutes ago, Lee D said:

Try creating a new master page, name it Soft Proof for easy reference. Now add a Soft Proof adjustment layer to the master page using the profile you want to export to. Now apply that master page to any others you may have which if setup will also apply to the other pages. Remember to delete or disable this master page before exporting.

As you already know, you can apply the colour profile when exporting to PDF and then compare the results. If needed make adjustments in Publisher before exporting again.

There are some additional considerations, I think, when using that approach.

1. If I remember correctly that adjustment layer will only be effective, when on a master page, if it is in a group. It can simply be grouped with itself. (I don't now if this is a feature or a bug, or if it's been fixed, and I can't experiment right now.)
2. As the softproof adjustment layer needs to be on top of the layer stack, if any pages have content that is not part of the other master pages the layer will need to be moved up on those pages. That will be tricky if the master page has been applied to the other masters.
3. When you apply Master B to Master A, B's content ends up below A's content on the document pages, and the softproof adjustment won't be effective as it needs to be above the other content.

I think the new master needs to be applied separately to the document pages, which will put it above the other masters. Then, if there is document content that is not in the master pages, one of the document pages with that content needs to be edited. Select the new master layer in the Layers panel, right-click and Edit Linked, then Layer > Arrange > Move to Front. That will put the master with the softproof adjustment on top of the stack on all the document pages it has been applied to, where the adjustment will be effective.

[thomaso]

14 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

There are some additional considerations,

Valuable hints, Walt! 🏆

By the way, this would be a nice use case for Global Layers, the required workaround illustrates the difference (disadvantage) between simple master page layers vs. true global layers.

[max3.2]

Well I suspected the master page approach but it’s really time consuming. I’ll stick to pdf proof until there’s a better solution thanks for the detailed answers!

[walt.farrell]

1 hour ago, max3.2 said:

Well I suspected the master page approach but it’s really time consuming. I’ll stick to pdf proof until there’s a better solution thanks for the detailed answers!

It shouldn't be that time consuming, really. For many document structures:

1. Add new Master (I'll call it Master B.).
2. Add SoftProof adjustment to Master B.
3. Group it with itself.
4. Apply Master B to all the document pages.
5. If the document page content is not all from another Master page, then pick a document page with content that is not from a Master.
6. On that page, click on Master B in the Layers panel, then right-click and choose Edit Linked.
7. With with the Master B layer still selected, use Layer > Arrange > Move to Front from the menu.

That's probably 3-5 minutes at most.

At that point you should have a SoftProof adjustment layer on each page. The more time-consuming part is looking at each page, and applying additional adjustments if any are needed. That will be the same whether you use the master page approach or the PDF approach, but with the master page approach you'll be able to see the results as you adjust each page, without having to recreate the PDF file to see the effects.

If a page needs further adjustments, insert them below the Master B layer in the page's Layers panel.

When you're done, edit Master B and hide the group that contains the SoftProof adjustment layer. Then recreate your PDF and verify that everything looks OK.

 

[lepr]

On 11/13/2020 at 11:08 PM, walt.farrell said:

It shouldn't be that time consuming, really. For many document structures:

1. Add new Master (I'll call it Master B.).
2. Add SoftProof adjustment to Master B.
3. Group it with itself.
4. Apply Master B to all the document pages.
5. If the document page content is not all from another Master page, then pick a document page with content that is not from a Master.
6. On that page, click on Master B in the Layers panel, then right-click and choose Edit Linked.
7. With with the Master B layer still selected, use Layer > Arrange > Move to Front from the menu.

That's probably 3-5 minutes at most.

At that point you should have a SoftProof adjustment layer on each page. The more time-consuming part is looking at each page, and applying additional adjustments if any are needed. That will be the same whether you use the master page approach or the PDF approach, but with the master page approach you'll be able to see the results as you adjust each page, without having to recreate the PDF file to see the effects.

If a page needs further adjustments, insert them below the Master B layer in the page's Layers panel.

When you're done, edit Master B and hide the group that contains the SoftProof adjustment layer. Then recreate your PDF and verify that everything looks OK.

 

 

That rigmarole is why it's a pity that we can't simply press a key or click a toolbar icon to toggle soft proofing (after initially selecting an appropriate proofing profile of course).

[max3.2]

And if I apply a master to my page which already has a master this will mess up my design since it’s one master only per page ... 

[Move Along People]

-

[h_d]

I may be missing something, but I don't see that you need to use an additional master page - you can apply a Soft Proof adjustment to the existing master(s) and adjust it and turn it on and off as required, and it will affect all pages in the document. This does require the Master layer to be at the top of the the layer stack for each page:

Above, colour image on page with greyscale Soft Proof adjustment in a group on Master A. (Image from Unsplash).

[walt.farrell]

2 hours ago, h_d said:

I may be missing something, but I don't see that you need to use an additional master page - you can apply a Soft Proof adjustment to the existing master(s) and adjust it and turn it on and off as required, and it will affect all pages in the document. This does require the Master layer to be at the top of the the layer stack for each page:

It's because it requires the Master Page to be at the top of the layer stack, which can be problematic when document pages have content that was not in frames inherited from the Master.

[walt.farrell]

3 hours ago, max3.2 said:

And if I apply a master to my page which already has a master this will mess up my design since it’s one master only per page ... 

No, you can have as many Masters applied to a page as you want. When you apply the second, third, etc. just don't select the option to replace the previous one(s).

[h_d]

1 hour ago, walt.farrell said:

it requires the Master Page to be at the top of the layer stack, which can be problematic

True enough - I guess it depends on the complexity of the document.

[thomaso]

7 minutes ago, h_d said:

I guess it depends on the complexity of the document.

Not necessarily complexity. Imagine a master layer is used to simply place 1 full size background (e.g. plain fill color only or an image, like a paper structure). Such a master is quite simple, it contains only 1 layer. But it has to be the bottom layer so that it doesn't cover another object.

Now you want to have page numbers, too. To avoid that any object on any document page (e.g. an image incl. bleed area) might cover the page numbers these must be in the foreground. That requires a second master page, simple again (2 layers only) but with its master layer on the document pages moved to front.

I would say it's still far from a complex document. The pity in Affinity is you need several separate masters as long the app lacks in Global Layers to enable a document wide layer hierarchy entirely independent of any master. So, the complexity of an actual simple document is currently "simply" increased by replacing global layers with the required use of masters instead.

[max3.2]

On 11/14/2020 at 12:08 AM, walt.farrell said:

It shouldn't be that time consuming, really. For many document structures:

1. Add new Master (I'll call it Master B.).
2. Add SoftProof adjustment to Master B.
3. Group it with itself.
4. Apply Master B to all the document pages.
5. If the document page content is not all from another Master page, then pick a document page with content that is not from a Master.
6. On that page, click on Master B in the Layers panel, then right-click and choose Edit Linked.
7. With with the Master B layer still selected, use Layer > Arrange > Move to Front from the menu.

That's probably 3-5 minutes at most.

At that point you should have a SoftProof adjustment layer on each page. The more time-consuming part is looking at each page, and applying additional adjustments if any are needed. That will be the same whether you use the master page approach or the PDF approach, but with the master page approach you'll be able to see the results as you adjust each page, without having to recreate the PDF file to see the effects.

If a page needs further adjustments, insert them below the Master B layer in the page's Layers panel.

When you're done, edit Master B and hide the group that contains the SoftProof adjustment layer. Then recreate your PDF and verify that everything looks OK.

 

Tried this approach - step 7 is grayed out and thus not working...

[walt.farrell]

6 minutes ago, max3.2 said:

Tried this approach - step 7 is grayed out and thus not working...

Is there content in that Document page above the Master in the Layers panel? That's required in step 5.

[max3.2]

...Kinda... I used nested masters, so there's the bottom master for page design, and another master on top with frames. The "content" is in the frames.

I applied the adjustment to the "bottom" master.

[walt.farrell]

1 hour ago, max3.2 said:

...Kinda... I used nested masters, so there's the bottom master for page design, and another master on top with frames. The "content" is in the frames.

I applied the adjustment to the "bottom" master.

I know it works (for me) with actual content directly on the document page. If everything is in the Master layers you might need to put something directly on the document page to get Layer > Arrange to work for you.

[PepGold]

On 11/15/2020 at 10:45 AM, lepr said:

 

That rigmarole is why it's a pity that we can't simply press a key or click a toolbar icon to toggle soft proofing (after initially selecting an appropriate proofing profile of course).

Yeah