Publisher global margin settings

[gw2020]

Hello all... Publisher newbie question: I want to reset the margins on an existing project. I go to Spread Setup, and change them on the Master page (=only used for page numbers) but they don't change on the existing pages, even with All Spreads set.

What I get is the existing pages with both the old and the new margins showing in blue in the Preview, but the text stays to the old margins. I'm sure it's something simple, but how can I get the new settings to work?

Thanks for advice...

[Old Bruce]

Hi and welcome to the forums @gw2020,

The Margins are only suggestions or guides of where things should go. Nothing is attached to them. If you want to change the text in your document then you'll have to change the size/location of the text frames. I tend to use a text frame on my master pages and that way I can change it once there and all the pages will get the changes too.

[gw2020]

Thanks for your reply, but I still don't get it.

I change the text frame on the master page, and that copies to all pages, but still the existing text is aligned to the old margins/text frame. How do I get the text on all the pages to align to the new text frame?

I'm probably older than you Bruce, so go easy.

[walt.farrell]

41 minutes ago, gw2020 said:

I change the text frame on the master page, and that copies to all pages, but still the existing text is aligned to the old margins/text frame. How do I get the text on all the pages to align to the new text frame?

You would generally start by making the text frame on the master page, then creating the document pages. They will then have that text frame on them, and if you subsequently make changes to the size/position of the text frame on the master page all the document pages should adjust.

It sounds like you started by creating individual text frames on the document pages, and if that's true I think you're stuck with adjusting them all manually.

[gw2020]

Yes, you're right. I set up the master pages with just the page number frames, and the main page frames were set up on page 1.

Now I understand what Bruce was saying! Luckily I'm not far into it, so I'll start again.

Thanks to you both for the help. GW

[jamesgangcreative]

On 10/28/2020 at 5:19 PM, Old Bruce said:

Hi and welcome to the forums @gw2020,

The Margins are only suggestions or guides of where things should go. Nothing is attached to them. If you want to change the text in your document then you'll have to change the size/location of the text frames. I tend to use a text frame on my master pages and that way I can change it once there and all the pages will get the changes too.

I created masters. I went into the master page to change the margins. I changed the margins in the master. Nothing resets. I get the same outcome. Two margins that show, but the content in the chapters and set to use Master "B" doesn't snap to the new one. So, if setting up the master page with a text box, then using that master page (in my case, Master "B") for all the chapters, then what is the process, or precedure, to set the master pages so if I need to change margins I can. "Looks like," "individual," "page number frames" etc doesn't really help. Steps please. It is so frustrating when one thinks they are doing something correctly and then there is some mystical, secret step that one is supposed to have been born knowing. As an aside, I haven't a clue as to what all those "things" are in snapping. I would think one could choose "snap to margin" and something would snap to it. But there are what, 15, 20 'snap' things ... I clicked everything on and off an nothing happens. So, I figure, "okay, that's not the secret."

 

[R C-R]

2 hours ago, jamesgangcreative said:

I created masters. I went into the master page to change the margins. I changed the margins in the master. Nothing resets.

What were you expecting to reset? Did you understand what @Old Bruce said about margins just being suggestions with nothing attached to them?

[walt.farrell]

10 hours ago, jamesgangcreative said:

So, if setting up the master page with a text box, then using that master page (in my case, Master "B") for all the chapters, then what is the process, or precedure, to set the master pages so if I need to change margins I can.

Change the margins. Then manually adjust the size and position of the objects (Text Frames, etc.) on the Master, the the changes will be reflected on the document pages that inherited from the Master. As mentioned above, the Margins are just guides to you to aid in object layout; they do not control anything themselves.

[jamesgangcreative]

10 hours ago, R C-R said:

What were you expecting to reset? Did you understand what @Old Bruce said about margins just being suggestions with nothing attached to them?

Apparently not. I was expecting the text boxes and content to snap to the change to .6" for the inside margin from .5". 

[jamesgangcreative]

2 hours ago, walt.farrell said:

Change the margins. Then manually adjust the size and position of the objects (Text Frames, etc.) on the Master, the the changes will be reflected on the document pages that inherited from the Master. As mentioned above, the Margins are just guides to you to aid in object layout; they do not control anything themselves.

Sorry, not following. I have masters that show empty text boxes. And I have spreads of chapters that have text in them. The image is a spread where you see the new and old margin but no text moved. I assumed when I changed the master text box margins that the spreads that used those master pages would then use the new margins. So, I think I what you're saying is go to the master, and look at where the new margin is appearing a drag a new text box to match the 'suggestion' as to where the new margin is. Maybe?

[Old Bruce]

5 minutes ago, jamesgangcreative said:

go to the master, and look at where the new margin is appearing a drag a new text box to match the 'suggestion' as to where the new margin is. Maybe?

Should be an old text box there on the Master page. Drag the original Text frame if there is one.

You may have created your document by drawing a text frame on the actual Page not on a Master Page. Am I correct?

[jamesgangcreative]

21 minutes ago, Old Bruce said:

Should be an old text box there on the Master page. Drag the original Text frame if there is one.

You may have created your document by drawing a text frame on the actual Page not on a Master Page. Am I correct?

Yes, I believe that may be what I did. I think I created a master with margins at .5". I then probably "added a page," chose the master to use, then dragged the content into the page so all pages would flow into it. Then I made new masters to use on pages so I would be able to create the odd/even and chapters start on right, etc. 

I tried created a new text box in the master... there was no text box there. 

So, if you have to have three or four masters, do you just create each master, with an empty text box in it? Then, let's say, pages 22 should be Master B and page 23 should be Master A. When you choose to use the different masters in the spread pages, everything then snaps to whatever the text box is inside that master? 

Just checked: I have three masters, mainly so some pages have no page numbers, some have a design on them (those are the right hand chapter settings, and the main book. They all have margins showing, but I did not make a text box in any of them. So, it appears I chose Master "B" for the bulk of the book and then flowed all the text into (B), using the other masters to change styles on individual pages. Am I correct then, that I should have created a master with a text box in it, then chose that to create pages from, then flowed the text into that text box? 

 

[Old Bruce]

14 minutes ago, jamesgangcreative said:

So, if you have to have three or four masters, do you just create each master, with an empty text box in it? Then, let's say, pages 22 should be Master B and page 23 should be Master A. When you choose to use the different masters in the spread pages, everything then snaps to whatever the text box is inside that master? 

It depends. I have text flowing through the Master page B text frames on pages 1-50. I now want to use the Master page A on page 23. There is text on page 23 and there are three text frames on Master A. Which one will have the text flow into and out of? Will any of them have the text?

I name my text frames and picture frames on the master pages, Left Page Header, Left Text, Right Page Header, Right Text etc. Master A and Master B will both have a text frame named Right Text so when I replace the masters the text will flow into that one.

Pay attention to these two choices, replace means the current Master will be removed, but not the content on the actual page. Migrate or Clear refers to the flowing text or placed photographs on the actual pages. You'll want to Replace and Migrate in most cases.

[Old Bruce]

For got the screenshot

[jamesgangcreative]

2 hours ago, Old Bruce said:

It depends. I have text flowing through the Master page B text frames on pages 1-50. I now want to use the Master page A on page 23. There is text on page 23 and there are three text frames on Master A. Which one will have the text flow into and out of? Will any of them have the text?

I name my text frames and picture frames on the master pages, Left Page Header, Left Text, Right Page Header, Right Text etc. Master A and Master B will both have a text frame named Right Text so when I replace the masters the text will flow into that one.

Pay attention to these two choices, replace means the current Master will be removed, but not the content on the actual page. Migrate or Clear refers to the flowing text or placed photographs on the actual pages. You'll want to Replace and Migrate in most cases.

All that works fine. The only problem is how to change the margins. I am going test and create a document using a text box dragged within the margins of a master page. Then I will do the auto flow into it. Then see if I change the size of the text box using the new imaginary margins as a guide if that changes the margins where that master is used. Then, I'll insert another master with another text box built in, following the imaginary margins and see if that also works. 

[Old Bruce]

27 minutes ago, jamesgangcreative said:

I am going test and create a document using a text box dragged within the margins of a master page. Then I will do the auto flow into it. Then see if I change the size of the text box using the new imaginary margins as a guide if that changes the margins where that master is used. Then, I'll insert another master with another text box built in, following the imaginary margins and see if that also works. 

I would suggest using radically different shape/size margins, small and square on one and tall and larger on the other so it is obvious.

[jamesgangcreative]

Good idea. 

[jamesgangcreative]

2 hours ago, Old Bruce said:

I would suggest using radically different shape/size margins, small and square on one and tall and larger on the other so it is obvious.

Just not getting this. I created two masters with big margin differences. I made a text box in master a. Placed the auto flow content in a page using master a. Great. Now... I want to change the text box to match a different set of margins right? I created master b. new margins. I applied master b to "all pages." Great. The new margins appear (as you say, they are just there as guides) but nothing shifts or snaps. That step am I missing? How do I copy all the content that has been placed into a new page set with a new master? Do I do a copy all, delete, then place and drag? 

[R C-R]

5 minutes ago, jamesgangcreative said:

The new margins appear (as you say, they are just there as guides) but nothing shifts or snaps.

This is because they are just guides. If you want to change the text frame to match the margin, you have to snap them (the text frames) to the margin.

For that to work, you need to make sure "Snap to margin" is enabled in the Snapping Manager.

[jamesgangcreative]

I just tried doing a copy, cut and paste, creating a new master, applying the master to the first page, and then pasting ... and it sort of worked. Then I tried it again and I had 180 pgs of page one .... 🙂 

[jamesgangcreative]

Just now, R C-R said:

This is because they are just guides. If you want to change the text frame to match the margin, you have to snap them (the text frames) to the margin.

For that to work, you need to make sure "Snap to margin" is enabled in the Snapping Manager.

Yes it is on.

 

[R C-R]

Just now, jamesgangcreative said:

Yes it is on.

OK, then you should be able to drag the control handles of your text frame(s) to snap to the margins.

Note that this does not happen automatically; this is something you must do manually. If your text frame(s) is on a Master page, doing this there will affect every page using text frame(s) from that Master.

[jamesgangcreative]

2 hours ago, R C-R said:

OK, then you should be able to drag the control handles of your text frame(s) to snap to the margins.

Note that this does not happen automatically; this is something you must do manually. If your text frame(s) is on a Master page, doing this there will affect every page using text frame(s) from that Master.

That's why I'm not getting this. I created a master page and created a text frame within it. However, when I change the text frame to match a new margin, nothing changes on the page. 

Old margin and old text frame in this example is the further one out. New "margin" and attempting to do an autoflow somehow using copy, cut and paste yielded nothing. I did have some success in creating a new master with a new text frame. Deleted the content, copied it. Chose the new master, dragged a text frame in it, then tried to paste the content. The first time I did that, I thought it had succeeded. The second time, I got 180 pgs, but all the first page. I'll keep testing, but I think that might be a work around to do the auto flow. I'd hate to have to try and fix a book with 300 pages in it one at a time. 

[R C-R]

38 minutes ago, jamesgangcreative said:

That's why I'm not getting this. I created a master page and created a text frame within it. However, when I change the text frame to match a new margin, nothing changes on the page. 

Are you changing the size of the text frame on the master page? If so, are you sure the document pages where the text frames are not changing are using the same master page & text frame(s) that you resized the text frame in?

Can you post a very simplified version of your document, with just a single master page, a text frame on it, & one or two document pages set to use that master page & its text frame(s)?

[jamesgangcreative]

25 minutes ago, R C-R said:

Are you changing the size of the text frame on the master page? If so, are you sure the document pages where the text frames are not changing are using the same master page & text frame(s) that you resized the text frame in?

Can you post a very simplified version of your document, with just a single master page, a text frame on it, & one or two document pages set to use that master page & its text frame(s)?

Thanks. I'll check and I'll see if I can get something attached that makes sense. Probably tomorrow (Monday) at this point. Thanks for your help and interest.