Odd bleed problem for Amazon PDF upload

[DrScardo]

Hi all

So I'm completely stumped as to why my document keeps getting rejected by Amazons' previewer robot. Or at least, I can see why, I just cannot seem to correct the issue.

So from page 4 onwards of my 32 page songbook, the background image I'm using as a paper texture does not bleed far enough to not leave a white border in their online preview box. BUT the first three pages are OK. As far as I can see all pages are set up the same way. I have individually gone through every page from 4 onwards and stretched the background image way beyond the border, so it should be more than big enough. I cannot see what is different about pages 1 -3 though. Anyway, exported and uploaded a new PDF (setting  - bleed box ticked, 400dpi) but the Amazon previewer still shows a white border from page 4 onwards. By the way I ordered  a print proof copy and there is not white margin there...:)...

Is there something on each page setting that determines how much bleed will be output to the pdf? And why on the first 3 pages is it fine?

Struggling with this - especially as it takes 30 - 45 mins to upload the PDF to Amazon, from the sticks here in rural Brittany.

Any help really appreciated!

Simon

 

[Old Bruce]

9 minutes ago, DrScardo said:

the background image I'm using as a paper texture does not bleed far enough to not leave a white border in their online preview box. BUT the first three pages are OK.

Where is the background image, is it on each individual page? I would place it on the bottom layer of each Master Page. You may have something on the pages 4 + that is extended past the page but not the bleed area. Are you placing images or PDFs on the individual pages?

[DrScardo]

Thanks for your reply Old Bruce.

I have the parchment image on every single page as when I tried to add to the Master page I couldn't seem to get it working properly. But I really have extended the image on pages 4+ to way further than those on 1-3 - so I don't know why there's a difference.

The parchment is a JPEG, and on the pages there's a combination  of text boxes, photo (JPEG) and TIFFs for the music scores.

Thanks

 

[DrScardo]

I've just tried "apply master to every page" and whilst the background image follows it - I cannot turn off the rest of the master page guides, my image disappears when I turn of Master in layers, and I cannot turn only master off -

 

 

[Old Bruce]

You have to right click (Control + Click) on one of the Master Pages layers (you should delete one of them, you don't need two) and choose Edit Detached from the Context Menu and then you can work on it. Alternatively you could go to the master page and turn off the Template Guides layer there if you don't need or want it to show.

Right click on the Red part to allow Edit Detached, right click on any of the layers inside the Master Page won't give you the context menu, only right clicking on the (A-Master) layer will show the context menu item Edit Detached.

[walt.farrell]

21 minutes ago, Old Bruce said:

You have to right click (Control + Click) on one of the Master Pages layers (you should delete one of them, you don't need two) and choose Edit Detached from the Context Menu and then you can work on it.

Right-clicking makes sense to me.

Control + Click doesn't because, as far as I know, that would merely select the layer (in addition to any already selected layers). You would still need to Right-click to get the Context menu with Edit Detached.

 

[DrScardo]

Thanks, OK that seems to work,  I just changed the viewable layers in the Master page first, to just show my background paper, then "apply to all pages", having deleted each individual JPEG background first. The exported PDF size is a lot smaller now! 

I stretched the background image well past the bleed marks in the Master page. One thing I'm unclear on - the "bleed settings" in document settings - currently set (by default?) to 0.125 inches - if I increase this size does this take away from the internal useable space on the page? Or does it extend the page outwards with more bleed when exported? The reason I ask is that in Amazon's e mail about the bleed problem they state "Add 0.125" (3 mm) to your book's page width and 0.25" (6 mm) to the page height" and I am confused by whether the template of US letter needs then to be larger?  Does changing this (when I tried it the entire document seemed to "flash") does this change the size of the contents? I don't want to have to start re-formatting the entire document. For now I have gone with your Master Page advice - keeping the original bleed settings to 0.125 as the first three pages worked fine that way, I'm assuming that it is operator (me) error on the further pages.

I hope this has solved the problem, but I cannot check until Amazon reject my last upload, which will take at least 24 hours.... 

Thank you so much for your help.

[DrScardo]

Oh but no! It gets weirder...

A few of the pages now have the TIFF overriding the master page so that there's a white block over the background - nothing different about these particular TIFFS exported from my scoring program...a dear, why is it so unpredictably complex?!

[Old Bruce]

19 minutes ago, DrScardo said:

One thing I'm unclear on - the "bleed settings" in document settings - currently set (by default?) to 0.125 inches - if I increase this size does this take away from the internal useable space on the page? Or does it extend the page outwards with more bleed when exported?

" - if I increase this size does this take away from the internal useable space on the page? " No.

"Or does it extend the page outwards with more bleed when exported?" The page size you set (example: 8 inches by 10 inches) remains the same but the paper size for the printing press increases.

An 8 inch by 10 inch page will be an 8 x 10 page, the paper needed to print this will need to be larger and the bleed (plus trimming marks) is on that larger size. The bleed is for trimming off and the trimming is sometimes wrong, you get a finished 8 x 10 page size but it may be from a little off centre from the printed paper. Generally the more accurate the printing and trimming the smaller the bleed size needed.

[DrScardo]

OK thanks for that sizing / bleed explanations that makes sense now.