Photo: lock layer - useless?

[Fritz_H]

Hi Forum,

In the layers-panel of Photo there is a lock-icon. It says "lock/unlock".
The german translation says more like: "protect/unprotect"   -    which is more specific than "lock" to me

BUT

The lock-icon has almost no effect:
I still can paint on that layer, I can delete it without warning, I can crop it,  etc. = no protection at all.

Can anyone please explain to me, what this "lock" is good for, since it does not apply any protection to that layer (besides moving it...)
Is there any other option available in Photo to really protect a layer?

Thanks in advance!

[MEB]

Hi Fritz_H,
The Lock feature only protects the layer from being selected and transformed on canvas (to prevent accidental changes). If selected from the Layers panel you can still change its attributes/paint on it - this is considered a deliberate action (by design) which also helps to perform changes to locked objects without having to lock/unlock them everytime. There's no way to "fully" lock an object in Affinity apps.

[Fritz_H]

39 minutes ago, MEB said:

Hi Fritz_H,
(...)There's no way to "fully" lock an object in Affinity apps.

hi @MEB
1. thanks for the quick reply
2. don´t you think, it would be a useful feature to be able to "fully lock an object in Affinity apps." ?

[MEB]

Hi Fritz_H,
Personally and in practise, i never run into issues due to the way it's implemented but i understand some users may have different workflows where this behaviour may interfere/may not be enough. If you could describe some use cases where a full lock does offer a meaningful advantage in practise or does affect your work negatively (unexpected results/accidental changes) it will be easier to make a case for improvements here. Most of the reports i saw regarding this feature were due to misunderstanding how it works, or supported on the fact that other apps offer a "full" lock by default giving a false(?) sense of added security. 

There's also a feature request here which you may want to add your voice too.

[GarryP]

Fritz_H: It might help if you can explain what you mean by “fully lock”.

For instance, do you mean that no changes can be made to a layer at all under any circumstances (until it is unlocked)?

If so, then what happens when a layer with an Erase Blend Mode is placed in the area above a “fully locked” layer? In this case “no changes can be made to a layer at all under any circumstances” would mean that the Erase Blend Mode could not have any effect on the underlying layer even though the intent of using the Erase Blend Mode was to alter it.

Another example is putting a Live Filter over a layer or set of layers. In this case “no changes can be made to a layer at all under any circumstances” would mean that the “fully locked” layer(s) would have to be unaffected by the blur which negates the intent of adding the live filter.

These are just two examples but I think they are enough to prompt some thought as to what “fully locked” might actually mean in practice. (Your idea of “fully locked” may not be the same as someone else’s idea of it, and the software probably won’t be able to do it all ways for all people.)

[MEB]

GarryP,
Usually fully locked simply means you can't edit/change the locked layer in any way. It still acts on/affects other layers no matter where it's placed.

[R C-R]

8 hours ago, MEB said:

If you could describe some use cases where a full lock does offer a meaningful advantage in practise or does affect your work negatively (unexpected results/accidental changes) it will be easier to make a case for improvements here.

Not necessarily a use case for a full lock, but related:

Consider opening a jpeg, png, etc. file in AP.  Because AP defaults to opening these files with the imported background layer selected, this layer is not selected by a deliberate user action.

Moreover, if the default (?) User Interface > Automatically lock background layer on import preference is enabled, because AP defaults to opening files with the View Tool enabled, there is no indication on the canvas that the layer is locked -- or anywhere else if the Layers panel is not visible.

So for example if a user is accustomed to relying on the Assistant Manager to add a new pixel layer when painting with no layer selected & has tuned off the alert when the manager takes an action, then they could easily start painting on the background layer when they expected they would be painting non-destructively on a new pixel layer.

Either a full lock or at least not selecting the imported background layer by default would avoid this.

[Pšenda]

10 hours ago, Fritz_H said:

don´t you think, it would be a useful feature to be able to "fully lock an object in Affinity apps." ?

 

[Pšenda]

9 hours ago, GarryP said:

In this case “no changes can be made to a layer at all under any circumstances” would mean that the “fully locked” layer(s) would have to be unaffected by the blur which negates the intent of adding the live filter.

I assume that it is quite obvious that it is a matter of protecting the contents of the layer, not their visual manifestations and influences.

[firstdefence]

Would it hurt to have a full lock or a choice of lock such as, lock and lock attributes? 

[Alfred]

8 minutes ago, firstdefence said:

Would it hurt to have a full lock or a choice of lock such as, lock and lock attributes? 

Is that your rhetorical question for the day, just as this is mine?

[firstdefence]