Affinity Develop personna problem

[Spud]

 

Sorry Serif, but you have a problem. 

I originally switched to Affinity because the software I was using (not Adobe) kept crashing. I was therefore delighted to have  a programme that just did it's job.

Of late however, Affinity is a pain to use. It started when I noticed that refreshing the display was slow and obvious then becoming blocky (grey squares).

It has now degenerated to dark images in Develop and then closing in Develop or after progressing to Photo.

I've read all the posts on this Blog and tried all the suggestions, pressing Ctrl when opening Affinity, uninstalling graphics card driver, changing driver from Studio to Game Ready, re-installing latest Affinity update, etc., etc. I've turned Tones and Exposure on and off in Develop Asst, and ensured I'm running RGB and it's 'managed.

What I've noticed of late is that, since doing the Ctrl-open app, the opening splash screen appears every time that I open Affinity, even if I uncheck the box. I've also noticed that selecting the 'Tones' & 'Exposure Bias' in the Develop Assistant do not appear to make any difference.

And, if I do get as far as 'Photo' the image from 'Develop' darkens after a few seconds and then Affinity closes down.

Set up is W10, Intel i58600, NVidia 1050Ti, 32GBDDR4 running latest Affinity.

All other photo processing software are running perfectly.

[Spud]

I forgot to mention that I'm loading .NEF files. Looked for Crash Reports but the folder is empty, despite the app crashing many, many times. Further observations If it crashes on loading into Develop, Histogram takes a while to apply Tone curve then it crashes. If I survive Develop and progress to Photo, after 2-3 seconds image darkens (histogram unchanged) then after a further 3-4 seconds app closes down.

As I've said above, I've uninstalled/reinstalled apps and drivers all weekend in various combinations, all to no avail.

Any help would be much appreciated.

[Ron P.]

@Spud,

I've tried replicating your problem, but haven't been able to so far. While I shoot Canon, I do have a few NEF files I've downloaded and used them. I have noticed they seem to take longer to Develop compared to my CR2 (Canon) files. I'm not sure why you're getting the blocky grey squares, or the other problems. Someone with more knowledge should jump in here at sometime to help with that, and probably one of the Serif Staff. What they may request is you attach the NEF file causing problems.

Sidenote: Nice username, had a cousin that everyone knew as Spud, was a great man. 😊

[Spud]

I forgot to mention that I'm loading .NEF files. Looked for Crash Reports but the folder is empty, despite the app crashing many, many times. Further observations If it crashes on loading into Develop, Histogram takes a while to apply Tone curve then it crashes. If I survive Develop and progress to Photo, after 2-3 seconds image darkens (histogram unchanged) then after a further 3-4 seconds app closes down.

As I've said above, I've uninstalled/reinstalled apps and drivers all weekend in various combinations, all to no avail.

Any help would be much appreciated.

Ron P

Thanks for response. Problem occurs with ALL files, not a few 'problem' files. Everything was working fine until a couple of weeks ago. W10/NVidia updates are the only changes to the system.

[Chris B]

Hey Spud,

If everything was working fine until a few weeks ago, it's likely something causing the blocks—more than likely GPU drivers. If you can show me a screenshot, that would be great. Also, what display profile are you using on Windows? Which Nvidia driver are you using? 

Also, the Ctrl runup should reset everything but any new chances, like turning off the splash screen should be remembered and written to appdata. 

[Spud]

Screenshot enclosed. I'm using the latest Studio driver. I've tried the Geforce Game, but it made no difference, I'm using sRGB colour profile. Got rid of the splash screen now (somehow). My main problem is  A. Opening .NEF file Affinity opens file then after a couple of seconds it closes down or b. I fiddle about in Develop, press the Develop tab, get the blue dotted line skimming across to show it's working, the image being same as when I left Develop, but once the blue dotted line has gone, the image darkens and the app closes. This happens on a random basis I'm afraid. Very occasionally I get to complete my adjustments and save in Photo. If I load a non RAW file, there are no problems. It all seems to revolve around the Develop module. As I say, I've uninstalled/reinstalled app and GPU drivers many times, restarting between each action. I've tried the Beta version and stepped back to 1.8.2 but to no avail. 

[emmrecs01]

@Spud

Can you attach one of your "problem" NEF files to your next post, to allow others to download it and test on their systems?

Jeff

[Spud]

2 hours ago, emmrecs01 said:

@Spud

Can you attach one of your "problem" NEF files to your next post, to allow others to download it and test on their systems?

Jeff

Thanks for your interest, but I'm 99% sure it's nothing to do with individual files as all files give me problems. However, your comments did spur me to try some .ARW files and, sure enough, Affinity shut down as soon as each of those loaded. To be honest, I don't know how to upload a 25MB file within this Forum.

[Chris B]

You should definitely be seeing some crash reports. There's two locations they can be found in, depending on where you purchased the app. 

They can be found in:

%AppData%\Affinity\Photo\1.0\CrashReports

or 

%AppData%\Affinity\Photo\1.0 (Store)\CrashReports

If you could double check both locations, that would be great. I will also link you to a private Dropbox folder where you can upload one of the images:
https://www.dropbox.com/request/rFYj3wAzlhbn4uuq8XlN

Please give me a nudge once it has uploaded as Dropbox doesn't notify me.

As far as I know, the Studio drivers should be fine. I believe they just don't contain the latest hotfixes for games but seeing as you've tried both you may as well leave them for now.

 

[Spud]

Hi Chris,

I bought AP through Serif. To prove I'm going to the right location, I attach two that happened earlier. Otherwise there's nowt in this, nor the Beta, version. (Very strange)

Also sent an image to Dropbox. This image was processed successfully in 2019 when it was first taken.

The problem arises with .nef, .dng and .ARW files. If I open jpeg or tiff files there is no problem. Everything works fine. It's only entering and leaving the Develop Personna - or so it appears to me.

The only other layman type observation is that the screen flickers once when the 'Develop' dotted blue line marking progress to Photo Personna finishes. This is the crunch point when the image is OK or darkens then AP closes.

Thanks for your efforts. I do use the Forum to try to sort out any problems before approaching your good self.

David

5dbb75ed-c9a3-4d7c-bb14-a59243a4e147.dmp b3a47033-6796-4013-a620-a6afa3693c9f.dmp

[Spud]

Hi Chris,

Noticed that if, in Develop Assistant, I change 'Apply Tone Curve' and 'Apply Exposure Bias' to 'Take no Action', when the programme crashes and I re-open it, my settings have been negated. 

David

[walt.farrell]

1 hour ago, Spud said:

Noticed that if, in Develop Assistant, I change 'Apply Tone Curve' and 'Apply Exposure Bias' to 'Take no Action', when the programme crashes and I re-open it, my settings have been negated.

The same happens if you change Preferences. You must successfully close the program, and restart it, to get the settings changed and remembered.

Edit: Note that you can open the Develop Assistant without having a RAW image open, which will make it easier to make those Assistant changes and then close Photo so they are fully saved.

[Spud]

5 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

The same happens if you change Preferences. You must successfully close the program, and restart it, to get the settings changed and remembered.

Edit: Note that you can open the Develop Assistant without having a RAW image open, which will make it easier to make those Assistant changes and then close Photo so they are fully saved.

Thanks Walt, you live and learn.....

David

[Chris B]

The image darkening happens on my retail version but I realised I was developing to wscRGB. Once I converted the document to use sRGB IEC61966-2.1 it was fine. 

I have done this 5 times on both retail and beta and did not experience a crash.

[Spud]

Chris, forgive my ignorance but, search as I may, can't locate where to find the Convert panel shown in your screenshot.

However, I enclose a screenshot from Device Manager for the 1050Ti and it shows something I don't understand. Don't know whether it's relevant or not.

I also show a screenshot from the Colour section of Preferences.

Finally a screenshot from my Control Panel Colour Management.

[Chris B]

Your colour settings in the app are fine. I would try adding the sRGB profile from Windows Colour Management though. I had the same BenQ profile a while ago and I recall it causing me some issues (possibly not related to Affinity).

The convert document option is found in the top Document menu then choose Convert Format / ICC Profile...

I noticed in an earlier screenshot you are not using Unmanaged in the 32 bit Panel so that's all good. 

We had an issue in the retail version where using multiple monitor could cause raw's to look dark but that was fixed in the beta. If you run the beta up holding Ctrl and reset everything, it might sort it out. You shouldn't need to worry about resetting the beta unless you have already customised the UI layout etc.

[Spud]

Hi Chris,

Did the convert. No improvement. The only reason I mentioned the 'darkening' is because it precedes AP crashing when going from Develop to Photo.

To summarise, my problem is that AP crashes in a random manner, either when opening a RAW image, or when the image is transferring from Develop to Photo. 

It may be my imagination but a crash when opening an image is usually preceded by a blank histogram for 3-4 seconds and the crash occurs when the histogram appears. GPU useage spikes at 100% when app closes. Also noted that AP power useage is 'very high' when opening files in Develop or going to Photo. It stays 'very high' for up to 5 secs. Other software seem to have blips at 'very high'. Just more observations in an attempt to help solve the mystery.

I have carried out a clean uninstall of Affinity Photo, removing every trace from my PC. As a result, once I can get an image to load into Develop and the programme not crash, I can now proceed to Photo, which is an improvement. However, I still have severe problems getting RAW files to load. Some load straight away, but most need 2.3.4 or more attempts. In every case of the programme shutting down, the histogram is blank or indicating an underexposed image. I get a greater success rate if I turn off 'Tones' in the Develop Asst' prior to loading. If I then turn it on. I get a really well developed image.

The new installation of AP still doesn't produce crash reports. However, I attach the latest user setup files in case they are of help.

Can I have some feedback/help Chris? 

SetupUI.log Setup.log

Edited July 31, 2020 by Spud
Additional info

[Chris B]

Hey Spud,

I've been working with the raw you uploaded for an hour or so this morning and I've been using it to test other issues and I haven't had a single crash with it.

When you say 'Some load straight away, but most need 2.3.4 or more attempts' do you mean it loads and crashes, doesn't load at all or loads and looks wrong?

At this point, I would recommend doing all your tests in the beta as it is more stable and has had lots of fixes.

Is the histogram blank in the Photo Persona or the Develop Persona? In the Develop Persona, it should update almost instantly as it is CPU driven. In the Photo Persona, it can take a while. An active selection (marching ants) can however cause it to not load at all.

[Spud]

58 minutes ago, Chris B said:

Hey Spud,

I've been working with the raw you uploaded for an hour or so this morning and I've been using it to test other issues and I haven't had a single crash with it.

When you say 'Some load straight away, but most need 2.3.4 or more attempts' do you mean it loads and crashes, doesn't load at all or loads and looks wrong?

At this point, I would recommend doing all your tests in the beta as it is more stable and has had lots of fixes.

Is the histogram blank in the Photo Persona or the Develop Persona? In the Develop Persona, it should update almost instantly as it is CPU driven. In the Photo Persona, it can take a while. An active selection (marching ants) can however cause it to not load at all.

Hi Chris,

As I've said before, the issue does NOT  appear to be with individual files. This fault is GENERAL across all files, .nef,.dng,.arw.

The file loads and then crashes. The appearance is as if the Tone Curve hasn't been applied. 

I've tried the Beta but the problem persists. Indeed, for some inexplicable reason, the problem of not being able to progress from Develop to Photo has returned. See screenshot of just before AP crashed. This is the 'darkening' I referred to earlier. Note, the histogram does not correlate with the image. The image was much brighter whilst the Develop tab with the moving blue line was operating. It darkened once that stopped.

The blank, or under exposed histogram appears in the Develop persona. As I've stated earlier, there is an approx. 5 sec delay between the image loading and the app closing down with the histogram blank or showing underexposed. There are no selections in any of the cases. I've got an i5 8600 CPU with 32GB of RAM with an M2 drive. More than adequate to deal with the job I would have thought. Task Manager shows the CPU operating below 90% but, just after the programme crashes, the GPU spikes to 100%.

[Chris B]

Sorry, I realise it is happening with different images but I was just stating that the file giving you grief, is working for me. 

Did you try the reset? Hold Ctrl when you launch the app, select everything and hit Clear (do that in the beta).

Your machine is definitely up to the task—there's no doubt about that. It could be a driver issue. Can you go to Preferences > Performance and set the Renderer to WARP and see if you can repo it? I'm suggesting this because you said the GPU spikes to 100% 

[Spud]

21 minutes ago, Chris B said:

Sorry, I realise it is happening with different images but I was just stating that the file giving you grief, is working for me. 

Did you try the reset? Hold Ctrl when you launch the app, select everything and hit Clear (do that in the beta).

Your machine is definitely up to the task—there's no doubt about that. It could be a driver issue. Can you go to Preferences > Performance and set the Renderer to WARP and see if you can repo it? I'm suggesting this because you said the GPU spikes to 100% 

I haven't the faintest idea what WARP is, but it seems to have done the trick. Both AP and AP Beta now perform without crashing (tested 20 images with each) all with 'Apply Tone Curve'. However, the histogram doesn't populate instantly and the changeover from Develop to Photo makes the image go 'blocky' for an instant. (Can't recall whether this happened before the current problem started).

So where do we go from here?

[Chris B]

WARP essentially means we ignore your dedicated graphics card, in your case the 1050Ti. We usually use it to workaround GPU issues or as a quick test to check for potential driver problems. This is why we recommend uninstalling GPU drivers and not just updating them.

You will also notice WARP is a bit slower than using your dedicated card for some things, however it shouldn't be making your image go blocky.

Can you go back to Windows Colour Management and uncheck the option for 'Use my settings for this device' and make sure you're using sRGB IEC61966-2.1.

 

[Spud]

27 minutes ago, Chris B said:

WARP essentially means we ignore your dedicated graphics card, in your case the 1050Ti. We usually use it to workaround GPU issues or as a quick test to check for potential driver problems. This is why we recommend uninstalling GPU drivers and not just updating them.

You will also notice WARP is a bit slower than using your dedicated card for some things, however it shouldn't be making your image go blocky.

Can you go back to Windows Colour Management and uncheck the option for 'Use my settings for this device' and make sure you're using sRGB IEC61966-2.1.

 

OK Chris. Job done as requested. See screenshot. Perhaps I'm being too demanding for a smooth transfer from Develop to Photo. I'm just trying to help by describing what I see.

I have uninstalled the graphics driver a couple of days ago, swapped to the 'games' driver, uninstalled that and gone back to the Studio driver, restarting each time.

Edited July 31, 2020 by Spud
amplification

[Chris B]

That's the System profile we want to be using. As long as there isn't a Device profile overriding it in the Devices tab everything is as it should be.

We should not be in 32 bit unless you have a HDR monitor that can display it properly. We should be developing to 16 bit with that profile and only use 32 bit if we're using a monitor that can handle a wide gamut. 

[Spud]

23 minutes ago, Chris B said:

That's the System profile we want to be using. As long as there isn't a Device profile overriding it in the Devices tab everything is as it should be.

We should not be in 32 bit unless you have a HDR monitor that can display it properly. We should be developing to 16 bit with that profile and only use 32 bit if we're using a monitor that can handle a wide gamut. 

Thanks Chris. WARP + the System profile I showed is getting the job done. I can now open RAW files in Develop and then progress to Photo.

Interestingly, I've just downloaded the latest 'Retail' version. Whereas the Beta performed as expected, the retail version has a 3 sec (approx) blank screen going from Develop to Photo, then the Develop tab with the blue dotted line does its thing.

Presumably, at some update in the future, I will be able to come out of WARP drive and revert back to my 1050 as the renderer.