menu "Window" > open files not listed

[thomaso]

In Affinity apps, the "Window" menu does not list all open documents, but only shows the currently selected one (which is particularly not necessary because it has already been selected and therefore its menu item is useless / obsolete as long it is the only one). Regardless of Separated Mode or not.

  

 

The goal of this menu section "by design" is to enable the user to switch between open documents, like here in the macOS Preview.app:

[Gabe]

Hey @thomaso,

I see where you're coming from, but the "Window" dialog is dedicated to actual "Windows/instances" and not tabs within apps. Our app can't have more than one session active, and the Window menu only shows the current session. More like this case.

Safari does the same thing. You have tabs inside a single window, which are not accessible through the Window menu.  

I moved this to feature requests, but I don't think there's much we can do, as it's working as designed. 

[walt.farrell]

Just curious if the issue is with Separated Mode?

Does it work as you prefer, @thomaso, if you're in normal (not Separated) mode?

I know that the Windows versions of the Affinity applications (which do not have Separated Mode) work as you show in your screenshot from Previews.

[thomaso]

Ah, I see, in Affinity (and e.g. browser.apps) open documents get listed only for not-merged windows but not for tabbed document windows ...

... while it is vice versa in Preview.app, where the complete list shows up for tabbed document view only.

Bit strange user experience. However, thank you for pointing me to this difference.

Feature request:
I would appreciate to have the option to get the entire open document list in the menu "Windows" when merged/ tabbed view is used.
As a supplement to the viewing options 'single document' vs. 'tabbed document' windows (merged).

[thomaso]

35 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

Just curious if the issue is with Separated Mode? (...)
I know that the Windows versions of the Affinity applications (which do not have Separated Mode) work as you show in your screenshot from Previews.

Oh, that's interesting. If I leave "Separated Mode" then all document's get tabbed + there is no way to have them in various windows.
(I use Separated Mode only to have the tool bars moved and use "Merge Windows" all the time).

But in macOS with not-separated but tabbed mode the menu "Windows" still shows as open document list the currently selected only but not all open documents.

So, @Gabe, if this open document list is treated different by Affinity in Windows OS than in macOS: is there any chance that the behavior on mac might have been programed this way kind of inadvertently, even though it's obviously "by design"? And therefore maybe worth to get logged?

[Gabe]

It's really been designed the other way around in this case, and Windows UI mimics macOS UI. 

 "Window" on macOS is a standard, built-in menu. https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guidelines/macos/menus/menu-bar-menus/

Quote

List open windows, not panels, as menu items at the bottom of the Window menu.List the windows in alphabetical order for quick access. When a user selects an available window in the Window menu, it comes to the front of the window stack.

In non-separate mode with non-merged windows, you get "Windows", which have their title bar and control buttons in the top right corner(Close, minimise, maximise) and these will appear in the "Window" menu. Otherwise, the whole "app" is considered a window. I don't see how this would work in non-separate mode or separate mode with merged windows, as by design, a window has to have its own title bar and controls. 

Now back to Windows (OS), the "Window" menu is something we have created, and not a standard OS, built-in menu. 

I hope it makes more sense now.

[thomaso]

> it makes more sense now.

Unfortunately it does not, it rather confuses more. Because...:

14 minutes ago, Gabe said:

I don't see how this would work in non-separate mode or separate mode with merged windows, as by design, a window has to have its own title bar and controls. 

You can see it working as all-open-docs-list in Preview.app:

1. One window with title bar and title of the currently selected document.
2. Below are tabs of all open documents.
3. The menu "Window" lists all open open documents / tabs.

This view occurs if you have chosen in the Preview.app prefs the third radio-button.

This preference corresponds in Affinity to "Separate Mode" + "Merge All Windows": 1 window & title bar + All tabs below.
But different to Preview in Affinity the list is not a list but reflects 1 document only, a copy of the title bar text (usefull?).

Note: In your Quote  "When a user selects an available window in the Window menu, it comes to the front of the window stack."  it seems to make no difference between window & tab view but rather, effectively, treats all / any as a stack of document windows, the user may select from ... and it does list them all, as shown in my recent Preview screenshot above.

[thomaso]

@Gabe, another macOS example is the Finder.app: here 1 window & tabs offers in menu "Windows" the list of them all + enables this way the user to switch:

Well, here one can simply click on the wanted tab instead using the menu. But in Affinity, in particular in dark UI + in a wider window, detecting and distinguishing tabs can be tricky and is less practical this way than a menu list.

Compare this Affinity visibility (= tab title readability) of open documents in the following screenshot with the clear view in the menu of the screenshot above.

[thomaso]

@Gabe, I just noticed in "View" the submenu "Views" which lists ALL open documents, even in separated mode & merged windows (> tabs), AND even mentions open documents which are parts of another (e.g. embedded), while the menu "Windows" always lists only 1 and apparently ignores an opened sub-document:

Menu "Windows": note that "...3.jpg" is the currently selected tab while it is part of the "v183" document:

Menu "View" > submenu "Views": not only ALL open documents are listed but also the currently selected "...3.jpg" appears and is ticked correctly:

So I wonder again whether the Affinity menu "Windows" mentions the documents properly (even if "by design"), since it ...

• behaves different in Affinity for macOS vs. Windows OS,
• the Affinity menu UI is well aware about opened documents,
• is able to list them ALL at once + complete with opened embedded,
• macOS Finder and Preview app also list all opened items in merged window/tab view.

Don't you agree that only 1 entry in the Windows menu is entirely useless, because it is nothing to choose from AND its text is prominently displayed already in the window title + in the toolbar. Finally the view > views submenu requires a little more complex mouse moves to get reached: vertically + horizontally + vertically. – Any chance to get it logged?

[Gabe]

17 hours ago, thomaso said:

Don't you agree that only 1 entry in the Windows menu is entirely useless, because it is nothing to choose from AND its text is prominently displayed already in the window title + in the toolbar. Finally the view > views submenu requires a little more complex mouse moves to get reached: vertically + horizontally + vertically. – Any chance to get it logged?

Agreed. I logged it as an improvement  

[R C-R]

On 7/6/2020 at 9:49 AM, thomaso said:

This view occurs if you have chosen in the Preview.app prefs the third radio-button.

The English version of that button in Preview.app is "Open each file in its own window," so it does not correspond in Affinity to "Separate Mode" + "Merge All Windows" -- it would correspond only if each document in Separated mode is in its own window (& it does work like that in Affinity).

Nevertheless, I agree that it would be very useful if the Affinity "Window" menu always listed every open document. But I am not sure that would be possible without creating some custom implementation of the built-in macOS Window menu. 

[thomaso]

8 hours ago, R C-R said:

The English version of that button in Preview.app is "Open each file in its own window," so it does not correspond in Affinity to "Separate Mode" + "Merge All Windows" -- it would correspond only if each document in Separated mode is in its own window

This is what it says – but that is what it does. This radio button text is different to its action. Have you tried it in Preview? To me it does exactly the same document and window arrangement as Separate Mode & Merge Windows in Affinity – but plus the additional open-file-list, as shown in the two screenshots in the post you quoted.

[R C-R]

46 minutes ago, thomaso said:

This is what it says – but that is what it does. This radio button text is different to its action. Have you tried it in Preview? To me it does exactly the same document and window arrangement as Separate Mode & Merge Windows in Affinity – but plus the additional open-file-list, as shown in the two screenshots in the post you quoted.

I do not understand what you mean. In Preview, using the third button causes each file to open in its own window. So if I open 3 documents I get 3 windows.

That is the same as what I get in the Affinity Separate mode only if I do not merge the document windows into a single (tabbed) window.

[thomaso]

7 minutes ago, R C-R said:

I do not understand what you mean. I

This is what I set ... and this is what I get: 1 window + tabs + file list.
Actually I don't care about the button text, here to me its functionality is the relevant:

[R C-R]

20 minutes ago, thomaso said:

This is what I set ... and this is what I get: 1 window + tabs + file list.

Weird. When I open 2 or more files in Preview with that setting, I always get each file opening in a separate window. For them to appear in the same window like they do at around the 9 second mark in your video I have to use Window > Merge All Windows as a separate step after the files have opened -- I can find no setting that causes all the files initially to open in one merged (tabbed) window.