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Major bug: Font extraction from Open type collection files.


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Affinity publisher is unable to extract OpenType collection files (formerly called TrueType collection) in PDF export. The styles (italic, blod, bold italic, etc.) are then not applied.

Example: Microsoft AngsanaUPC font. This is a free Thai font from Microsoft.

export-pdf-02.png

6 cœurs, 12 processus - Windows 11 pro - 4K - DirectX 12 - Suite universelle Affinity (Affinity  Publisher, Affinity Designer, Affinity Photo).

Mais je vous le demande, peut-on imaginer une police sans sérifs ?

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Do you have a single TTC file for these fonts?
If Yes, where did it come from?
I know Microsoft, but where was it included?
The last place I have seen these fonts is v5.01 which was included with Win 8.1.
Do you have a newer or different version?

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Why a second thread for the same matter?

4 hours ago, LibreTraining said:

The last place I have seen these fonts is v5.01 which was included with Win 8.1.

Do you have a newer or different version?

I asked this already, but got no answer.

------
Windows 10 | i5-8500 CPU | Intel UHD 630 Graphics | 32 GB RAM | Latest Retail and Beta versions of complete Affinity range installed

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Hi LibreTraining.

My first professional version of Windows is 10. So I don't have the right to use an earlier version of font.

AngsanaUP is delivered in a single OpenType collection file called angsana.ttc containing 8 fonts version 5.05: Angsana New, Angsana New Italic, Angsana New Bold, Angsana New Bold Italic, AngsanaUPC, AngsanaUPC Italic, AngsanaUPC Bold, AngsanaUPC Bold Italic.

If you use another version of font with only one font per file, it is illegal. https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/typography/fonts/font-faq

Quote

Hidden fonts—those that don’t show up in font menus, which may be embedded in code—are not covered by this guide and should not be extracted and used.

 

6 cœurs, 12 processus - Windows 11 pro - 4K - DirectX 12 - Suite universelle Affinity (Affinity  Publisher, Affinity Designer, Affinity Photo).

Mais je vous le demande, peut-on imaginer une police sans sérifs ?

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  • Staff

Hi @Pyanepsion

When you duplicate threads (reported in the wrong place - Feature requests in this case) please link your new thread to the old one...

Issue logged. I replicated this with the default pack that gets installed with Thai Language, on Windows 10.

 

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  • 4 weeks later...

Test with public 1.8.3.641 and beta 1.8.4.663.

In fact, the Affinity suite is the only one that does not allow the use of the OpenType collections, and it is never just an oversight or minor bug since on screen it appears correctly, as well as when printing directly to an inkjet or laser printer.

Here for information the Microsoft fonts delivered by default and free of charge with Windows 10 that it is impossible to use in the Affinity suite because of this mistake: Angsana New, AngsanaUPC, Batang, BatangChe, BIZ UDGothic, BIZ UDMincho, Browallia New, BrowalliaUPC, Cambria, Cambria Math, Cordia New, CordiaUPC, Dotum, DotumChe, Gulim, GulimChe, Gungsuh, GungsuhChe, Meiryo, Meiryo UI, Microsoft JhengHei, Microsoft JhengHei UI, Microsoft YaHei, Microsoft YaHei UI, MingLiU, MingLiU-ExtB, MingLiU_HKSCS, MingLiU_HKSCS-ExtB, MS Gothic, MS Mincho, MS PGothic, MS PMincho, MS UI Gothic, NSimSun, PMingLiU, PMingLiU-ExtB, SimSun, Sitka, UD Digi Kyokasho N-B, UD Digi Kyokasho NK-B, UD Digi Kyokasho NK-R, UD Digi Kyokasho NP-B, UD Digi Kyokasho NP-R, UD Digi Kyokasho N-R, Yu Gothic, Yu Gothic UI.

AngsanaUPC.afpub

6 cœurs, 12 processus - Windows 11 pro - 4K - DirectX 12 - Suite universelle Affinity (Affinity  Publisher, Affinity Designer, Affinity Photo).

Mais je vous le demande, peut-on imaginer une police sans sérifs ?

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46 minutes ago, Pyanepsion said:

Here for information the Microsoft fonts delivered by default and free of charge with Windows 10

My Windows 10 installation does not include Angsana New or AngsanaUPC.

Where can I get them?

-- Walt
Designer, Photo, and Publisher V1 and V2 at latest retail and beta releases
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There are two possibilities.

Warning: some fonts are very large in memory.

  1. By region: Settings/Applications/ Optional Features/ Thai Supplemental Fonts.
  2. All: Settings/Fonts/ Download fonts for all languages.

6 cœurs, 12 processus - Windows 11 pro - 4K - DirectX 12 - Suite universelle Affinity (Affinity  Publisher, Affinity Designer, Affinity Photo).

Mais je vous le demande, peut-on imaginer une police sans sérifs ?

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  • 1 month later...
On 5/26/2020 at 2:43 PM, Pyanepsion said:

Affinity publisher is unable to extract OpenType collection files

Hello,

I was describing almost 2 months ago the bug in exporting OpenType font collections: example the Angsana font.

I'm surprised it still hasn't been rectified. We are now at the third beta update!

  • However, this is a major blocking bug. There's no way around it.
  • Its amplitude is important since it affects about 1 font out of 10 of all fonts offered for free by Microsoft, and this score will increase since all new Microsoft fonts are Opentype collections. And, most large foundries now only offer Opentype collections.
  • It also seems to be a rather minor cause since the appearance on screen and printer is correct. Only the PDF export seems to be concerned.

Then what's going on?

6 cœurs, 12 processus - Windows 11 pro - 4K - DirectX 12 - Suite universelle Affinity (Affinity  Publisher, Affinity Designer, Affinity Photo).

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21 minutes ago, Pyanepsion said:

And, most large foundries now only offer Opentype collections.

Really? Most — if not all — of the OpenType collections of fonts that I have are those supplied with Windows, and none of the many fonts that I have purchased over the past few years have been supplied as OpenType collections.

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Affinity Designer/Photo/Publisher 2 for Windows • Windows 10 Home/Pro
Affinity Designer/Photo/Publisher 2 for iPad • iPadOS 17.4.1 (iPad 7th gen)

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5 of the 8 major foundries already only offer their new fonts as an Opentype collection.

Even if the rate would be lower, the simple fact that Microsoft offers 162 free fonts, many of which are now in the form of an Opentype collection (in addition to the paid ones) should be enough to correct this blocking bug in an emergency!

6 cœurs, 12 processus - Windows 11 pro - 4K - DirectX 12 - Suite universelle Affinity (Affinity  Publisher, Affinity Designer, Affinity Photo).

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  • 2 weeks later...

I saw your remark on PDF exports, and that problem may actually be controlled by the font itself. Go down to “Document embedding” in the following link:

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/typography/fonts/font-faq
 

The problem is not new, but hard to trace, if you’re not aware of a probable cause.

I have personal experience with this “side effect”, although it was some years ago, it is still a possible problem.

The actual font specification allows a font to specifically prevent embedding (for example doc(x) or PDF files). Look at the flag “fsType” on the link:

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/typography/opentype/spec/os2#fstype
 

where several options are documented. If Publisher respects this flag - as it should - your problem may be caused by the flag value.

Not all software respects this flag (leading to legal issues inadvertently for users, when the “font owners” try to uphold their copyright).

Hope this will help trace down your problem.

Regards

 

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Hello, Kfriis.

You may have found the reason for this bug of the Affinity suite. It is possible that Affinity’s PDF export may not correctly read the embedded licensing rights flag when it is a collection of TrueType fonts. It reads it well when it displays the font on a screen or when it prints it, including … printing in PDF with Microsoft Print to PDF.

As with all the other free Microsoft fonts for Windows, Microsoft TrueType font collections are editable (read and write) and can be freely embedded in the data transmitted to the print media (in practice a PDF file).

Note that the Microsoft Office suite (Word, etc.), QuarkXPress, and the Adobe suite (Indesign, etc.) create the PDF file correctly. It is understandable these manufacturers since almost all new fonts from the major foundries are now essentially TrueType collections.

All TrueType font collections are affected by this bug of the suite Affinity, regardless of all the foundry.

AngsanaUPC-printing-by-Microsoft-Print-to-PDF.pdf

AngsanaUPC.afpub

6 cœurs, 12 processus - Windows 11 pro - 4K - DirectX 12 - Suite universelle Affinity (Affinity  Publisher, Affinity Designer, Affinity Photo).

Mais je vous le demande, peut-on imaginer une police sans sérifs ?

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Re: “free Microsoft fonts for Windows, Microsoft TrueType font collections are editable (read and write) and can be freely embedded in the data transmitted to the print media (in practice a PDF file).”

This is NOT necessarily true. I do not have the actual link present anymore, and it’s not my task to follow this up, but somewhere !! while looking for documentation, there was a caveat depending on this, that and the other (one item was - as far as I remember - whether you used i.e, home and student version of Office or the home and business version etc. - just to mention one side remark  I noted - and interpreted wrongly or correctly - in passing).

For all we know, Adobe may have special license agreements with some type foundries.

You’ll have to dig deeper to actually decide, who’s right or wrong in which environment on what platform using this, that or the other software. Font licensing and copyright limitations and enforcement was invented, when typesetting was a strictly physical procedure; since then a small army of lawyers have had their chance to complicate things to the extreme ;-)

I’m not “taking sides” or blaming you or affinity or anyone else. Try to fetch a low level font inspection (developers) tool or some such, and let it loose on the involved fonts.

It may be a case of the “collection” containing ONE, SINGLE font with some, maybe even minimal, restrictions. How does the collection - as such - signal to the outside world, that it may be subject to restrictions for one, many or all fonts in the collection?

If affinity has a bug - and I’m deliberately using the term IF - then it may interpret the collection correctly as such, but not handle individual members correctly as individuals, as you indicate. It is entirely possible, but not necessarily ;-)

I’ve experienced worse in my programming career before I retired - including this weird sub-sub-sub-field of obfuscation and complication leading to a lawyers delight of chaos ;-)

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I'm afraid you're wrong about two things. The Microsoft TrueType font collections offered free with Windows 10 Pro are specifically editable says Microsoft. And the flag of all fonts is set to Editable.
You can check it with the freeware (but then you get your money's worth, i.e. not much) Fontforges. Here is what two other specialized paid software give.

PS. Digging a little deeper, I see that Word prints correctly also with Adobe PDF, but that Affinity mixes Normal, Italic, Bold and Mixed styles.

angsana-01.png

 

angsana-02.png

6 cœurs, 12 processus - Windows 11 pro - 4K - DirectX 12 - Suite universelle Affinity (Affinity  Publisher, Affinity Designer, Affinity Photo).

Mais je vous le demande, peut-on imaginer une police sans sérifs ?

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I hear you, but... MY Windows 10 Pro has no Angsana New font installed, and deliberately clicking “Get fonts for all languages” as well as checking, that fonts are NOT limited by language settings, leads to the font still not being present in my recently updated Windows 10 Pro 2004 version.

I have Personally diceded to use ONLY Google fonts, where nothing else is forced on me. The licensing terms are endearingly clear, and I.e. the font Noto - which I personally prefer - is available in any imaginable (even some unimagined) languages with special variants, as well as current, historical if not downright pre-historic alphabets of most any sort.

These fonts are freely available, and the Google font library is - quite frankly - enormous.

It may not cover your use case, but I’m free to choose, so I tend not to use anything else, unless really, really, REALLY necessary!

On Microsoft’s webpage: 

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/typography/font-list/angsana-new

there is a link to the license conditions - varied and many - and especially the ePub license may be of interest (on this page):

https://www.fonts.com/content/microsoft-typography

It specifically mentions:

”-An ePub license is valid for file formats such as PDF, EPUB 2.01, EPUB 3, and KF8.“

Note the “PDF” here!

The redistribution FAQ shown here:

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/typography/fonts/font-faq

is not for the faint hearted either.

I’m not commenting further on this subject/topic, and since the licensing terms seem to be both varied and complicated (containing many legal points in the fine print), things may not be as clear cut, as you think. I’m no lawyer, so... I’ll leave things there.

Good luck with solving your conundrum!

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No worries.
I've actually been working on the Microsoft font license and I'm sure of myself. Not being able to export TrueType font collections is indeed a bug in the Affinity Suite.
The gist is here:
https://docs.microsoft.com/fr-fr/typography/fonts/font-faq

Quote

The most common setting for Microsoft supplied fonts is “editable embedding.” When this flag is set an authoring application may embed the font into a saved document file. When the document is opened on a machine that does not have the font installed the application may allow the document to be edited.

You can find Angsana with Thai fonts.

Download
You will find all the fonts provided free of charge with Windows 10 from the Settings window by going to:
- Applications/Optional Features/Selected Regional Policies;
- Customization/Fonts/Download fonts for all languages;
- Customization/Fonts/Get more fonts from Microsoft Store.

6 cœurs, 12 processus - Windows 11 pro - 4K - DirectX 12 - Suite universelle Affinity (Affinity  Publisher, Affinity Designer, Affinity Photo).

Mais je vous le demande, peut-on imaginer une police sans sérifs ?

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  • 2 months later...

Time goes by and True Type collections are still not exportable or printable in PDF format.

6 cœurs, 12 processus - Windows 11 pro - 4K - DirectX 12 - Suite universelle Affinity (Affinity  Publisher, Affinity Designer, Affinity Photo).

Mais je vous le demande, peut-on imaginer une police sans sérifs ?

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Doesn't sound good. I think this issue -along with a lot of others - requires an official statement from Affinity. Time's up.

Seen from the "outside", Affinity seems to practice the same public stance, as MI5/MI6 in the previous century and GCHQ still tries to do (hiding "no comment" and "non-existence" in plain sight ;-). The only difference is, that Affinity has to exist as a legal entity, if they want our money ;-)

There exists a decent amount of unsolved problems, missing features, lacking options etc. in Publisher, and the ostrich approach and trying to keep mum doesn't solve anything. Acknowledging accompanied by a host of bad excuses summed up to "will - probably - be looked into at some undefined future time" followed by "no promises" in some form, is getting  a bit off-putting after some time.

Why not let us - your, ahem, valued (?) customers - have some solid explanations and a prioritized  time-table (even a tentative one) on the "currently unresolved issues". Version 2 cannot be far off, so what are the plans, the probable features and the definite additions and remedies to be delivered - especially when!

Behaving as a coy pre-teenager with princess attitudes - although an unusually "silent" version - solves nothing in the long run. You may run out of "value" that way.

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  • 3 weeks later...

I made the same observation with the Microsoft Office series and with QuarkXPress. It's about time Affinity fixed this very big bug.

6 cœurs, 12 processus - Windows 11 pro - 4K - DirectX 12 - Suite universelle Affinity (Affinity  Publisher, Affinity Designer, Affinity Photo).

Mais je vous le demande, peut-on imaginer une police sans sérifs ?

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  • 2 years later...

There is an improvement with version 2.2.0.1903 beta.

  1. The PDF file is now all in Angsana regardless of the font style.
  2. On the other hand, only the Regular style is displayed, whatever the style.
  3. In addition, the underline style is a combination of Angsana Regular with an underscore instead of Angsana Underline, and each of the 3 lines is separated instead of being continuous.
  4. Each block of 3 lines of the PDF can now be modified with Adobe Acrobat Pro to give it Bold, Italic, Bold-italic styles.

6 cœurs, 12 processus - Windows 11 pro - 4K - DirectX 12 - Suite universelle Affinity (Affinity  Publisher, Affinity Designer, Affinity Photo).

Mais je vous le demande, peut-on imaginer une police sans sérifs ?

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