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Style previews becoming unreadably small


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In the screen capture attached, you can read the 'heading 1' style, but the 'heading 2' and 'heading 3' style previews are unreadably small. (You'll also notice that the 'box' is pretty small too)

I have to think that this is a bug of some kind - both of those headings are using a background stroke decoration, set to twice the height of the font. I wonder if that might be the problem area here (see second screenshot)

 

 

image.png.86f6ec71dc4d75b573baf53e4b2540d8.png

 

image.png.c93b0dc0948c7e62de3e881567b5cc06.png

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As a workaround: You can change the Text Styles display via its hamburger menu, and turn off "Show Samples":

image.png.8d8622a64284d9cef3973c0d5e15ba7d.png

-- Walt
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1 hour ago, Alex White said:

I have to think that this is a bug of some kind - both of those headings are using a background stroke decoration, set to twice the height of the font. I wonder if that might be the problem area here (see second screenshot)

With the setting in your screenshot (14/18pt) I get this preview, definitely larger text size than yours:

32778232_textstylepreviewsize2.jpg.beee90a243e13a0d197400538bbd1856.jpg

Whereas with 5pt font size the preview text size comes closer to yours:

400798247_textstylepreviewsize3.jpg.a51c7f92c17e0155cfb29465b8ff21e8.jpg

Possibly your screenshot of the style previews does not belong to the settings, neither as described nor as in the 2nd screenshot.
Note if you alter a style the preview isn't updated simultaneously with any value change.


However, concerning size there I can't see a bug. There is simply no way to show a preview in correct ratio (font + stroke offset) in the available preview space, as you also see with drop caps:

1728322482_textstylepreviewsize1.jpg.934676fedd8686051a2563aeaeeb7808.jpg

 

macOS 10.14.6 | MacBookPro Retina 15" | Eizo 27" | Affinity V1

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5 minutes ago, thomaso said:

With the setting in your screenshot (14/18pt) I get this preview, definitely larger text size than yours:

Trust me, I'm showing the correct screenshot of the correct styles - it isn't rocket science, and I just don't have that many options!

Over time, you may well see the preview shrink - I'm sure that mine started off at that kind of size, but has gradually got smaller to its current illegibility

I'm still convinced it is a bug - the key text of the heading shouldn't become invisible because of a decoration - much better to trim the top and bottom of the decoration. Drop caps is a special case IMO because you need to be able to see the relationship between the initial letter and the other text. 

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1 hour ago, Alex White said:

Trust me, I'm showing the correct screenshot of the correct styles - it isn't rocket science,

Rocket science: How large is the font size if the deco stroke width = twice the size of the font = 18 pt ?

a. 14 pt, trust me!
b. 9 pt
c. I don't know

571475099_Bildschirmfoto2020-05-11um15_16_28.jpg.6ed90716537a826627d9f0081af2befb.jpg

115513307_Bildschirmfoto2020-05-11um15_18_07.jpg.f2f31b01e6141c2c42fbac3f4fef051b.jpg
357471711_Bildschirmfoto2020-05-11um15_18.07Kopie.jpg.f79d96f220a6f3b474b3a97348abb359.jpg

 

1 hour ago, Alex White said:

I'm still convinced it is a bug - (...) - much better to trim the top and bottom of the decoration.

Trimming wouldn't be correct too and cause complaints about an incomplete preview. – A software problem where the correct solution is a matter of feeling rather than of fact is hardly a bug. Some call such an issue "by design" in differentiation to "a bug", regardless whether "by design" also means "in purpose".

macOS 10.14.6 | MacBookPro Retina 15" | Eizo 27" | Affinity V1

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As I said, I’m showing the correct screenshots for the styles. 

So my text doesn’t match up. Big deal. Don’t be a dick about it.

You don’t see a problem. Fine. I couldn’t care less. 

I see a problem. I report it to the developers, they get to choose what to do, not some random poster. 

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It's just that I can't reconstruct your preview size with the given values. That made me doubt, also since the written info varied.

Can you open the attached .afpub and make a screenshot of both your text styles panel + the bottom frame selected?
Also I'd like to get your .afpub with the style from above to possibly detect what's wrong or may cause a different appearance.

v183 style previews.afpub

macOS 10.14.6 | MacBookPro Retina 15" | Eizo 27" | Affinity V1

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Sure - thanks for continuing to work with me on this. It shows me that I'm noticing something which I've not got perfect reproduction steps for yet...

 

Here is your attached file opened up, with the bottom frame selected - this looks OK (and -originally- this looked fine for me too in my file)

image.thumb.png.b2ccf509ee8556579870b3478d8ec05a.png

 

The following is from another file of mine, where it is also working OK

 

image.png.72eb55608b2e0665fa08b497d444f2a1.png

 

 

 

 

This one is from a file converted from IDML. After the conversion the stroke looked fine on the page, but showed much narrower in the styles pane. If I applied the style, it is only a very narrow stroke (4.3pts) as you can see in the immediately following screenshot

image.png.b9a72d5bdd7bfbcc4f749921b403eb32.png

 

image.png.2d3649c19be4823ebd4f1089f02db682.png

 

The document I have at the top of this thread is one which was imported from IDML, had an imported stroke of 4.3pt which I edited back up to 18pt. As soon as I do that edit, the style preview shrinks down teeny-tiny. 

I've been able to produce a screen recording of this, but it is 10mb and so I can't post it here. I'll see if I can put a link to it somewhere or compress it.

 

Regards

 

 

 

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On 5/11/2020 at 9:07 AM, Alex White said:

I see a problem. I report it to the developers, they get to choose what to do, not some random poster. 

If I might just make this side comment so we all understand one another better… What you say there is true, and I have felt similar sentiment about Thomaso in bug posts of my own, but it all comes down to different personalities and different cultural backgrounds. Thomaso, I am convinced, is really just trying to be helpful, and for my part, I am overly sensitive. And I will say, once Thomaso learned about that personality quirk (or flaw, if you will) of mine, he has been very good to deal kindly with me, and I appreciate him all the more for it. For my part, I better understand that Thomaso is not attacking or belittling me, but any perceived slight I might feel is because we are just not "speaking the same language."

That's just my own experience, which may or may not be helpful to you. I just mean to say that the more I have seen of Thomaso's many posts, the more I realize how much he is a valued member of this community. In fact, when I consider the degree to which he goes in helping people or in leaving feedback for Serif (often with colored diagrams), I would be hard-pressed to think of anyone who gives more effort at contributing to this community (except perhaps a certain Mr. WF—not my place to decide who is more dedicated than whom, but these are the two that stand out in my mind).

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On 5/11/2020 at 7:56 PM, thomaso said:

Can you attach an .afpub with a frame that has Heading 3 assigned? (If possible before your stroke width change from 4.3 to 18 pt.)

Sorry for the delay, other 'world' stuff got in the way. 

The attached .afpub file has a small text fragment copied from an idml imported file. The imported rendering has a super-high stroke, the definition is still on 4.3pt (and if you apply the heading 3 you'll see the stroke change). 

I would be interested to see whether you can replicate the situation with this file.

 

Thanks

demo of heading style.afpub

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I experience various issues with your .afpub. - None of them seems to be caused by any possible bug in the saved text style sample size of APub, but instead to the idml import or "just" caused by this .afpub being corrupted. I noticed that your imported decorations in the styles Headline 3 and Headline 4 are defined as bottom stroke whereas they visually actually are meant to appear as fill instead - I wonder if this setting maybe a confusion during idml import + causing the later issues. To inspect this aspect you could change this decoration setting in InDesign and do an new idml import. - Anyway you might upload the used idml here in case a developer wants to reproduce and investigate the issue.

Obviously these imported styles are corrupted somehow - while any new created styles in your document with same settings show their samples previews in usual size.
Even if I altered your imported Headline 4 by replacing its deco bottom stroke with a deco fill instead + saved as Headline 5 then its sample size is fine.

It appears this entire document is corrupted somehow concerning some dimensions - not sample size only - because of my odd experience when I try to select some text frames I created in this document. In the video it starts at 42 sec that I try to select the text frame "Headline 3", it is hardly possibly, most often selects the frame below. But if the wanted frame gets selected, then I seem to be unable to access its text but again the cursor selects the frame below. - Finally it is quite strange that frames get selected from quite a far distance (up to ~ 30 mm, which of course is no snapping distance).

demo of heading style_ot.afpub

macOS 10.14.6 | MacBookPro Retina 15" | Eizo 27" | Affinity V1

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  • 2 months later...
  • Staff

@thomaso, the code behind the problem you describe has been improved in the 1.8.4 release

Patrick Connor
Serif Europe Ltd

"There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man. True nobility lies in being superior to your previous self."  W. L. Sheldon

 

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