Book Layout: Flow Text and Master Page / Sections Issue

[Helmar]

Ok, here's the scenario for which I am looking for a solution:

• I am busy layouting a book.
• I have my text frames all connected from page 1-x. and one large text filling the frames, making up the book.
• I allocate master pages when new chapters start.
• New chapters are also new sections, from which I grab the name to fill the <SECTION NAME> variable which shows up at the top of each right-hand page.
• So far so good.
• Now if for whatever formatting reason the length of the text changes (images, formatting, spacing), the master pages "move", messing it all up.
• If I disconnect the text frames between two chapters, the text flow gets interrupted. It stops with that frame, emptying all those frames that were previously filled on the subsequent pages.
• So... am I'm thinking out loud here... the only solution is to split the text by chapter, rather than having it flow from chapter 1-x.
• Only when the text is split I can probably add new pages after a "chapter", leaving the other pages untouched.
• I did that to try it out, and it indeed inserted hundreds of pages after the last "frame".

SUMMARY (and I stand corrected if you have a better solution): IF you edit a book with many chapters, DO NOT throw it all into one text-flow from beginning to end. Rather start new text flows at the beginning of each chapter, because that leaves the master pages intact, should you add new text to one chapter or change the formatting requiring more space/pages.

Looking forward to your ideas/experiences.

Helmar

 

[Seneca]

20 minutes ago, Helmar said:

Looking forward to your ideas/experiences.

Well, you seem to treat Publisher like a Word Processor. You should only start page-making business if your text is complete or almost complete.

If you add pages, delete text things will move and there is nothing you can do about it.

Whether you do it in inDesign, QuarkXpress or Publisher you should start layout out pages only if your text will not change. (Edits are to be expected of course).

Magazines and leaflets are a different beast. Most of the pages are independent and you can add, delete them at will.

 

[Helmar]

3 minutes ago, Seneca said:

Well, you seem to treat Publisher like a Word Processor. You should only start page-making business if your text is complete or almost complete.

The text is complete, but the formatting is in flux.

3 minutes ago, Seneca said:

If you add pages, delete text things will move and there is nothing you can do about it.

I noticed that much.

I'll now try to separate the chapters without AFP crashing. Wish me luck. Failing that, I'll do it all in one big text-flow.

[Giovanni Pietri]

Hi there.

Of course, since design work is done on the basis of intellectual production (whether scientific or artistic, etc.) by people, not by robots, this will be subject to change. The author gives the "supplies" to the layout designer, and he does his work, gives the first draft, usually in PDF, and the corrections are worked on the result, by the professional style editor who does his part based on this because it allows him to identify in which lines, paragraphs, pages and chapters the errors or changes are, ergo, sometimes you have to eliminate and sometimes you have to increase the texts, if they are short, are typed and if they are long texts and sometimes whole chapters are copied and pasted, it is not a problem since we work with styles in the program, it is the same dynamic in all the different BOOK layout programs that exist, and according to my experience with AfPublisher, that could not be a problem, it is not necessary to make small sections (maybe chapters) if you do not want to and put the whole text working with the technical resources of the paragraph flow, etc.
However, I like better the idea of doing it in sections for each chapter, as it is more orderly and logical, but it is up to each individual.
When increasing large amounts of text, using the copy and paste system in AFP you will increase pages, choosing the corresponding master pages and don't forget to make the links between the corresponding text boxes until you finish.

[Seneca]

1 hour ago, Helmar said:

I'll now try to separate the chapters without AFP crashing

Hi @Helma

Splitting your book in independent chapters may afford you the most flexibility. You can add, or delete pages at will without worrying about how things may change down the line.

Please let us know whether that has made any difference working on your book.

Best regards

[Helmar]

22 hours ago, Seneca said:

Hi @Helmar

Splitting your book in independent chapters may afford you the most flexibility. You can add, or delete pages at will without worrying about how things may change down the line.

Please let us know whether that has made any difference working on your book.

Best regards

@Seneca @Giovanni Pietri @Gabe Here go. A rather lengthy video (15min) showing you how I split the long flowtext into individual chapters. AFP rocks! Unfortunately the embedded upload failed twice, so I sent it to Youtube for now. Enjoy.
 

 

[Move Along People]

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[Seneca]

6 hours ago, haakoo said:

Your video is not showing anything.

You may need to downsample your video because as haakoo says the video doesn't show anything. 🙂

[sfriedberg]

19 hours ago, Seneca said:

Well, you seem to treat Publisher like a Word Processor. You should only start page-making business if your text is complete or almost complete.

I don't think I've worked on a long format project that didn't end up with at least 10% changes.  Not just fixing typos, either.  And as a general rule, the client vehemently doesn't want to wait for final edits before they see the first layout.  Frequently, academic papers get written up, reviewed by outsiders with a delay measured in months, then the author rewrites things based on the review comments.  Sometimes the changes are minimal, sometimes significant new sections are added from scratch.  There is inevitably a serious deadline pressure to remake the layout for the final version of the document, so just throwing the initial document away and starting from scratch with the final text is not a very efficient way to do things.

It would be a lot easier to do that (throw it all away and start from scratch), if AffPub had a quick way of saving inserted images and text frames being used as display blocks (presumably as assets, and preferably in order of appearance by page and layer).  Then you could delete the old text, place and flow the new text, then walk through the document placing all the saved inserts.  Unfortunately, "Assets cannot contain embedded documents."

[Helmar]

@sfriedberg, @Seneca, @haakoo

Video embedded above via Youtube. Enjoy!
 

PS: the master page frame on the chapter page has since been adjusted. 🙂

[Sabz]

Hi Helmar, unfortunately your video doesn't open on youtube for me either. I am dealing with similar issues to what you describe here, so it would be valuable for me to watch your video if at all possible. Thanks.

[Helmar]

26 minutes ago, Sabz said:

Hi Helmar, unfortunately your video doesn't open on youtube for me either. I am dealing with similar issues to what you describe here, so it would be valuable for me to watch your video if at all possible. Thanks.

I'm sorry, I deleted my entire YouTube presence, and therefore that particular video, too. I'll check if I still have a copy on my disk. If I do, I'll upload it to Odysee, where I found a more welcoming and friendlier home. If not, I'll create a new one for you 

Cheers, Helmar 

[Sabz]

8 minutes ago, Helmar said:

I'm sorry, I deleted my entire YouTube presence, and therefore that particular video, too. I'll check if I still have a copy on my disk. If I do, I'll upload it to Odysee, where I found a more welcoming and friendlier home. If not, I'll create a new one for you 

Cheers, Helmar 

Thank you so much. Hope it's not too much trouble!