Conde Posted February 28, 2020 Share Posted February 28, 2020 (edited) Hello, There is a problem when importing / placing a PDF created by Sibelius (Music Notation software) . The PDF (see attached example) looks different from the original. Sibelius creates PDF 1.4 I´m working on Mac OS X Mountain Lion, Publisher 1.8. Everything looks good in QuarkXpress. Edited February 28, 2020 by Conde Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benwiggy Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 PDF import is the Achilles' Heel of the Affinity Suite. Anything that uses text glyphs in complex ways -- ligatures, glyph variants, OpenType features -- cannot be relied upon to display correctly. Notation software such as Sibelius uses fonts for many of the symbols, as you will know. The 1.8 update seems to be a bit better than before, but there are still problems. The official line is that it's not a bug, but that importing PDFs with embedded fonts (i.e. all print-compliant PDFs) is 'not supported'. What's most curious is that Affinity will import EPS files of essentially the same data perfectly. So that's one workaround.PDF import: EPS import: The other solution is to "Outline" all text in the PDF. This means converting the text data into 'raw' vector line and curve data. There should be no loss of quality, but you need a software tool that can do it. Most Adobe software can do it (but then you wouldn't be here!). The command-line PDF tool GhostScript can do it, with the suitable incantation: /usr/local/bin/gs \ -dNOPAUSE \ -dBATCH \ -dNoOutputFonts \ -sDEVICE=pdfwrite \ -sOutputFile="OutputFilename" \ <inputFilename> Also: Mountain Lion? You're lucky Affinity works at all, as that's below the minimum system requirements (10.9 Mavericks). You should be able to run El Capitan (10.11), even on the oldest hardware. garrettm30 and Conde 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conde Posted March 2, 2020 Author Share Posted March 2, 2020 Thank you benwiggy for your detailed answer. Sorry - how stupid of me, I am using Capitan 10.11. - Sibelius writes PDF 1.4 (Mountain Lion). I also noticed writing in Sibelius EPS. With 200 pages of music score and TABs, this problem appears in one composition consisting of three voices. As long as there is a solution, everything is okay. It makes no difference to me to export EPS. I did this for decades. Publisher, to be precise the whole Affinity Suite, surprises me in every way. Since I am switching to Catalina later this year, ending my 25-year love-hate relationship with Adobe (Suite 5.5.), I am not confident that Publisher and Designer are completely sufficient for my needs. However, there are still huge differences between Photoshop and Photo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garrettm30 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 I agree with benwiggy's characterization of this as Affinity's Achille's heel. The solution given for the problem of the lack up embedded fonts is usually that the font must be installed and active, or else font substitution will occur. We then suppose that there is no problem as long as the fonts in question are available for Publisher to use. We can see from this post another example of why inability to read embedded fonts is not the only problem with the lack of a true passthrough implementation. In this case, it appears that the fonts in use were installed on the system and available to Publisher, but Publisher still failed to faithfully reproduce the PDF while it tries to make the placed PDF editable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benwiggy Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 6 minutes ago, garrettm30 said: The solution given for the problem of the lack up embedded fonts is usually that the font must be installed and active, or else font substitution will occur. We then suppose that there is no problem as long as the fonts in question are available for Publisher to use. Having the fonts installed is not enough: Affinity fails to reproduce even basic fi and fl ligatures in Times New Roman. This very day, on another forum, someone was asking for alternatives to InDesign. His work involves placing PDFs on pages, so I was unable to recommend Affinity Publisher. If you can import an EPS with non-installed, embedded fonts correctly, then really, there's no reason why a PDF made from that very EPS should produce bizarre results. The Affinity 'engine' is over 5 years old now. Photo can't raster a PDF. Publisher can't place one. Designer can't edit one. These are all long-solved problems. It's a very ugly stain on an otherwise brilliant suite. I hope we don't have to wait for version 2.0 - or longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wonderings Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 2 hours ago, benwiggy said: Having the fonts installed is not enough: Affinity fails to reproduce even basic fi and fl ligatures in Times New Roman. This very day, on another forum, someone was asking for alternatives to InDesign. His work involves placing PDFs on pages, so I was unable to recommend Affinity Publisher. If you can import an EPS with non-installed, embedded fonts correctly, then really, there's no reason why a PDF made from that very EPS should produce bizarre results. The Affinity 'engine' is over 5 years old now. Photo can't raster a PDF. Publisher can't place one. Designer can't edit one. These are all long-solved problems. It's a very ugly stain on an otherwise brilliant suite. I hope we don't have to wait for version 2.0 - or longer. This is the number 1 reason I do not use it other then testing and like you why I cannot recommend Publisher. Part of page layout and design is using customer PDF's and not always have access the fonts and really not needing the fonts as the PDF itself is not being edited. This has been an issue since the BETA but many seem to think of it as a feature having a PDF editor in their page layout software. I do not want Indesign to edit my PDF's and I certainly don't want Publisher. I would think this would be more handy in Designer if they are going to edit PDF's anywhere. Hopefully this becomes a priority as it is a foundational feature for the program in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff Gabe Posted July 3, 2020 Staff Share Posted July 3, 2020 Hi all, Sorry for the delayed reply. We believe we have fixed this issue in the latest beta (based on the files we have had from other customers). If you could, check it and see how it goes. If you're still affected, please come back with some sample files and we can have a look Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benwiggy Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Gabe, is that 1.8.4.663, dated June 17, or a new one since then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff Gabe Posted July 3, 2020 Staff Share Posted July 3, 2020 That's the one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff Patrick Connor Posted August 6, 2020 Staff Share Posted August 6, 2020 We have made fixes/improvements to this area (Incorrect import of PDF with musical font from Sibelius) of the program in the latest release. The fixes and how to update are described in these forum posts. Affinity Designer 1.8.4 for Windows ( Microsoft Store and Affinity Store ) Affinity Designer 1.8.4 for macOS ( Mac App Store and Affinity Store ) Affinity Designer 1.8.4 for iOS ( Apple iPad Store ) Affinity Photo 1.8.4 for Windows ( Microsoft Store and Affinity Store ) Affinity Photo 1.8.4 for macOS ( Mac App Store and Affinity Store ) Affinity Photo 1.8.4 for iOS ( Apple iPad Store ) Affinity Publisher 1.8.4 for Windows ( Microsoft Store and Affinity Store ) Affinity Publisher 1.8.4 for macOS ( Mac App Store and Affinity Store ) We would appreciate you checking that this issue has now been resolved for you, Quote Patrick Connor Serif Europe Ltd Latest V2 releases on each platform Help make our apps better by joining our beta program! "There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man. True nobility lies in being superior to your previous self." W. L. Sheldon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benwiggy Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 2 minutes ago, Patrick Connor said: We would appreciate you checking that this issue has now been resolved for you, There are still several issues relating to fonts/glyphs in imported PDFs, particularly related to ligatures, OpenType alternates, and PUA Unicode ranges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff Patrick Connor Posted August 6, 2020 Staff Share Posted August 6, 2020 @benwiggy Please can you be explicit (screenshots and/or sample files) thank you @Gabe Please investigate the remaining issues Quote Patrick Connor Serif Europe Ltd Latest V2 releases on each platform Help make our apps better by joining our beta program! "There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man. True nobility lies in being superior to your previous self." W. L. Sheldon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benwiggy Posted August 7, 2020 Share Posted August 7, 2020 11 hours ago, Patrick Connor said: @benwiggy Please can you be explicit (screenshots and/or sample files) thank you Affinity cannot handle the fi and fl ligatures in this PDF. Untitled Project 1.pdf Also: create a PDF in Affinity Publisher that contains Small Caps, Non-lining numerals, Swash Italics, and other OTF variants. Then import the PDF back in. Results can vary form font to font, but even using Adobe / Monotype fonts, e.g. Minion, Kepler, Garamond, there are problems. These have been reported many times. Patrick Connor 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joachim_L Posted August 7, 2020 Share Posted August 7, 2020 38 minutes ago, benwiggy said: Also: create a PDF in Affinity Publisher that contains Small Caps, Non-lining numerals, Swash Italics, and other OTF variants. In my case I use a font with lining numerals, creating a PDF in APu and opening this PDF again in APu results in non-lining numerals. Doing this in ID and opening the PDF in Illustrator results in numerals converted to curves. Here is this particular font to blame. I asked the distributor of the font if this is ever going to be fixed, which they denied. Quote ------ Windows 10 | i5-8500 CPU | Intel UHD 630 Graphics | 32 GB RAM | Latest Retail and Beta versions of complete Affinity range installed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benwiggy Posted August 7, 2020 Share Posted August 7, 2020 1 minute ago, Joachim_L said: Here is this particular font to blame. I asked the distributor of the font if this is ever going to be fixed, which they denied. It's not the font's fault. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joachim_L Posted August 7, 2020 Share Posted August 7, 2020 7 minutes ago, benwiggy said: It's not the font's fault. How do you know? Illustrator failed, Inkscape failed, so ... LibreTraining had an explanation for "my" font failing. Quote ------ Windows 10 | i5-8500 CPU | Intel UHD 630 Graphics | 32 GB RAM | Latest Retail and Beta versions of complete Affinity range installed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benwiggy Posted August 7, 2020 Share Posted August 7, 2020 Test this PDF, made in Aff Publisher. It contains Non-lining figures in several different Adobe / Monotype fonts. -- Caslon, Garamond, Baskerville, Bembo, etc. They are all outlined in Illustrator, because they are alternate glyphs that can't be mapped back. If you claim that these fonts are 'wrong', then almost every font is wrong and we can't use any of them. Or, the application should work with fonts as they are. That is what Illustrator does, by outlining the glyphs. That is what Affinity should be doing. Instead, Affinity imports this PDF and switches in the default glyphs.Figures.pdf Pauls 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnleesanders Posted March 2, 2022 Share Posted March 2, 2022 Hi, I'm trying to correct a score that was created in Sibelius, and need to move a music symbol called a "mordent" above the note. I lost the Sibelius file, and it would be much easier to edit these small fixes in Affinity Publisher. I can move the note but not the symbols attached to it. Any workarounds? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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