IDML export

[walt.farrell]

11 hours ago, ronnyb said:

Hello devs: Any update or news about this very important feature request?

The developers generally do not comment on feature requests nor do they reveal future plans or what they're working on until the function is ready (or nearly ready) to release to the users. The first indication of a new feature is usually its appearance in a beta release, so if you watch the beta announcements you'll have as much information as anyone outside of Serif has

 

[ronnyb]

Thanks Walt, been here long enough to know how that works. We don’t need a release date to corner the devs into, but we still need to know if this is in the pipeline...

Still, the question remains for the Devs: any update if this feature is coming? For many of us, although Publisher is a great app, specially for v1 release, lack of file exchange with InDesign is a show stopper for most of our clients and their projects. A lot of printers and clients don’t only want the final PDF, they want access to the file to be able to tweak in-house without having to go back and forth with the designers for minutia.

I would venture to say that at this stage of the game, file format interoperability is more important than new tools, a plug-in architecture, and many other professional features that InDesign offers, which often times there are creative workarounds for... 

[Frozen Death Knight]

13 hours ago, ronnyb said:

Thanks Walt, been here long enough to know how that works. We don’t need a release date to corner the devs into, but we still need to know if this is in the pipeline...

Still, the question remains for the Devs: any update if this feature is coming? For many of us, although Publisher is a great app, specially for v1 release, lack of file exchange with InDesign is a show stopper for most of our clients and their projects. A lot of printers and clients don’t only want the final PDF, they want access to the file to be able to tweak in-house without having to go back and forth with the designers for minutia.

I would venture to say that at this stage of the game, file format interoperability is more important than new tools, a plug-in architecture, and many other professional features that InDesign offers, which often times there are creative workarounds for... 

It most likely is. However, just like all the other requests they have received and responded to over the years, it will likely take some years before we see it come into fruition. For instance, the devs said during the 1.7 Beta period early last year that GPU acceleration was being worked on for Windows, and only now in 1.9 do we get to see the results of that work with last week's Beta build.

You might convince the devs that this feature is important enough to get pushed to the top of the priority list, but with all the other stickied Publisher threads talking about missing features, my guess is that at least a couple of them will have priority over this one, especially if there is less complexity to fixing those problems over this one. You might get it sooner, or later. I seriously doubt they would refuse putting the feature in when it is in everyone's best interest that Affinity has nearly matching functionality with its Adobe counterparts.

[emarillo]

6 hours ago, ronnyb said:

I would venture to say that at this stage of the game, file format interoperability is more important than new tools, a plug-in architecture, and many other professional features that InDesign offers, which often times there are creative workarounds for... 

I agree with you.

[walt.farrell]

9 hours ago, ronnyb said:

lack of file exchange with InDesign is a show stopper for most of our clients and their projects. A lot of printers and clients don’t only want the final PDF, they want access to the file to be able to tweak in-house without having to go back and forth with the designers for minutia.

Just be aware that there may be:

1. Lack of features in Publisher, or
2. Features that are implemented differently (as Publisher is not trying to be InDesign), or
3. Features that exist in Publisher but not InDesign.

All of those will mean that file interchange is never likely to be 100% successful.

[wonderings]

10 hours ago, ronnyb said:

Thanks Walt, been here long enough to know how that works. We don’t need a release date to corner the devs into, but we still need to know if this is in the pipeline...

Still, the question remains for the Devs: any update if this feature is coming? For many of us, although Publisher is a great app, specially for v1 release, lack of file exchange with InDesign is a show stopper for most of our clients and their projects. A lot of printers and clients don’t only want the final PDF, they want access to the file to be able to tweak in-house without having to go back and forth with the designers for minutia.

I would venture to say that at this stage of the game, file format interoperability is more important than new tools, a plug-in architecture, and many other professional features that InDesign offers, which often times there are creative workarounds for... 

This sounds like a nightmare. If you really want files that printers or anyone can adjust and change without issue then you want to use Indesign. Even if you could save as an IDML file in Publisher you are in for a world of headaches when things do not export properly and open correctly in Indesign.  I would say most if not all printers do not want files that have been exported from a different app to open in Indesign, this is not helpful as there is no way to know if what I see in Indesign is what you saw in Publisher. The only solution for this is to use the same app and this is another case where Adobe CC is great. Everyone has the same version (save for the few small shops that are holding on to CS6 while the rest of the world moves on). 

[garrettm30]

12 hours ago, ronnyb said:

A lot of printers and clients don’t only want the final PDF, they want access to the file to be able to tweak in-house without having to go back and forth with the designers for minutia.

For reasons such as Walt and Wonderings have said, it is not likely we will ever get to the point where IDML import or export (from Publisher, Markzware, etc.) can be relied upon to be 100% faithful reproduction. Even the simple matter of different text layout engines will mean that text of any significant length will flow differently, and that can entirely break a design, not to mention other feature differences.

If clients need a usable file in InDesign (as opposed to just a backup), and you are agreed to provide them such a file, then it seems the only professional option is to prepare it in InDesign, which means either make it in InDesign in the first place, or, if Publisher ever can export to IDML, then you would export to IDML and then fix the imperfect export with InDesign so that you can save a print-ready InDesign file.

It is one thing if the client just wants a way to get at the assets for reworking into other projects or for backup. I think an export from another program may suffice in such cases. But as you say they want to be able to tweak in-house without going back to the designer for minutia, then any export from a third-party program is not likely to provide a file ready to tweak minutia and go back to print. For example, if they just want to fix a typo or adjust some detail like a date for upcoming event, they would open the IDML, make the change, and go to print, only to find out that some other aspects of the design have changed from your original work, quite possibly in a significant way, and that will reflect poorly on your work.

[Fixx]

On 9/25/2020 at 4:46 PM, garrettm30 said:

the only professional option

Exactly. If customer want ID file, do the job in ID. Trying to do it any other way is just trouble.

[HarryJ]

+1 for IDML-Export

[Metty Eisenbein]

 

On 9/26/2020 at 8:31 PM, Fixx said:

Exactly. If customer want ID file, do the job in ID. Trying to do it any other way is just trouble.

Doesn't make sense. I bougt Affinity in order NOT to use ID. 

[garrettm30]

3 hours ago, Metty Eisenbein said:

Doesn't make sense. I bougt Affinity in order NOT to use ID. 

That's perfectly fine. Just expect to make good Publisher documents with Publisher, not the documents of the competing software that you are not willing to use.

Note that I am not arguing against IDML export, but just that the idea that Publisher could ever output an InDesign file that is faithful and reliable is never going to be a reality no matter how many resources Serif tries to pour into it. If a paying customer wants an InDesign file that is reliable for tweak and send back to print, then you will never be able to rely on Publisher to get that job done.

[Fixx]

On 10/7/2020 at 12:52 PM, Metty Eisenbein said:

 

Doesn't make sense. I bougt Affinity in order NOT to use ID. 

Right. You can also insist that customers use Publisher.

[Seneca]

On 10/7/2020 at 2:29 PM, garrettm30 said:

Note that I am not arguing against IDML export, but just that the idea that Publisher could ever output an InDesign file that is faithful and reliable is never going to be a reality no matter how many resources Serif tries to pour into it.

Absolutely right and this point needs to be reminded to those who hope to get a faithful rendition of any inDesign file in Publisher.

However, I also think that it's of vital importance that Publisher exports its files in IDML format as well. IDML has become the cross platform file format between Publishing applications. To be able to open a file created in Quark or inDesign or in VivaPublisher or Publisher on any if these platforms, however inaccurate, is a win win situation without any question. 

[emarillo]

1 hour ago, Seneca said:

Absolutely right and this point needs to be reminded to those who hope to get a faithful rendition of any inDesign file in Publisher.

However, I also think that it's of vital importance that Publisher exports its files in IDML format as well. IDML has become the cross platform file format between Publishing applications. To be able to open a file created in Quark or inDesign or in VivaPublisher or Publisher on any if these platforms, however inaccurate, is a win win situation without any question. 

I totally agree. The only thing that keeps me tied to InDesign is my clients' request to get IDML files (along with the hi-res printing PDFs) for archiving purposes. They'll probably never touch them again, but they insist on having them. 

[tonywaghorn]

IDML Export would be a big benefit in collaborating with colleages on different software.
Designer exports SVG and EPS making it somewhat compatible with Illustrator 
Photo exports PSD

 

 

[wonderings]

1 hour ago, tonywaghorn said:

IDML Export would be a big benefit in collaborating with colleages on different software.
Designer exports SVG and EPS making it somewhat compatible with Illustrator 
Photo exports PSD

 

 

How would it be a big benefit for collaborating? If you start in Publisher and hand it off for someone else to work on now in Indesign are they going to fix the issues from the conversion first and then when they pass it back to you in Publisher are you going to fix again the new issues being converted back for Publisher? All you are doing is creating more work for yourself.

If you truly want to collaborate use the same software. 

[tonywaghorn]

8 minutes ago, wonderings said:

How would it be a big benefit for collaborating? If you start in Publisher and hand it off for someone else to work on now in Indesign are they going to fix the issues from the conversion first and then when they pass it back to you in Publisher are you going to fix again the new issues being converted back for Publisher? All you are doing is creating more work for yourself.

If you truly want to collaborate use the same software. 

It's not so much collaborating on a single file on a single project but being able to package something that could be opened up later by someone else.

In my case it's translation work on brochures. At the end of putting in the translation, I'd like to save in a file format someone else can open.

I work for a global charity, I can't mandate they all use one design package or our contractors - or at least it will take time.

[wonderings]

57 minutes ago, tonywaghorn said:

It's not so much collaborating on a single file on a single project but being able to package something that could be opened up later by someone else.

In my case it's translation work on brochures. At the end of putting in the translation, I'd like to save in a file format someone else can open.

I work for a global charity, I can't mandate they all use one design package or our contractors - or at least it will take time.

The same issue applies. If they need to open up a working file you should be using what they are using. Be it Publisher or Indesign. If they just need reference than a PDF would be ideal as they can't mess anything up seriously without trying. 

You can't mandate but you can make the decision to stay compatible with them. Publisher will never have a perfection translation to and from Indesign.

[tonywaghorn]

1 minute ago, wonderings said:

The same issue applies. If they need to open up a working file you should be using what they are using. Be it Publisher or Indesign. If they just need reference than a PDF would be ideal as they can't mess anything up seriously without trying. 

You can't mandate but you can make the decision to stay compatible with them. Publisher will never have a perfection translation to and from Indesign.

So to be cheeky - I throw in the towel on Affinity and go back to InDesign?

IDML into Publisher works fine - I'm not looking for perfection - I'm happy with minor tinkering, but so far, all is well.

I'm not entirely sure why you would not want an editable option out (until the rest of the world sees that serif are offering a better model)?

[wonderings]

On 10/13/2020 at 8:52 AM, tonywaghorn said:

So to be cheeky - I throw in the towel on Affinity and go back to InDesign?

IDML into Publisher works fine - I'm not looking for perfection - I'm happy with minor tinkering, but so far, all is well.

I'm not entirely sure why you would not want an editable option out (until the rest of the world sees that serif are offering a better model)?

Personally I would not use Publisher if everyone I was working with used Indesign (which they do).

It can work fine for you but the other way around giving to someone can be a problem. You may know to check for issues, they may not or they may but don't as is all to common when simply giving proofs for people to check. In some very light tests I have had issues from placed PSD files which required me going back to fix the PSD or change format (I don't remember what I did but I am sure it was simple). Not sure why you would want to have to go and fix files and constantly and be checking for issues. Not enough hours in the day for me and that would be a major headache if I was receiving Publisher files exported to IDML for me to then go over and correct. 

Not sure what better model Serif is offering other than being cheap and not as feature rich. That is not a knock, the price is great but it is not comparable to Adobe in it's present state so the price is warranted. There is a lot more to Adobe CC then just the applications which again makes it more feature rich... which comes with a price. 

 

[Petar Petrenko]

If I were Affinity I would keep only PDF, GIF and PNG export filters and would add as much as possible import filters for the files Affinity supports.

They are now well known, everybody is going to leave Adobe sooner or later, so why IDML export filter..

I stopped using CorelDRAW, Xara, Quark, Photoshop, Illustrator... and when Affinity add footnotes -- goodbye InDesign.

[wonderings]

20 minutes ago, Petar Petrenko said:

If I were Affinity I would keep only PDF, GIF and PNG export filters and would add as much as possible import filters for the files Affinity supports.

They are now well known, everybody is going to leave Adobe sooner or later, so why IDML export filter..

I stopped using CorelDRAW, Xara, Quark, Photoshop, Illustrator... and when Affinity add footnotes -- goodbye InDesign.

I would say everyone leaving Adobe is a long long way off, if at all. The subscription model is not the end of the world. I would prefer the option to go without, but it does not kill me to have it. 

Why gif? All I know about this extension is the moving images I use in text messages. Is there something else gif is good for?

 

[Patrick Connor]

4 hours ago, tonywaghorn said:

It's not so much collaborating on a single file on a single project but being able to package something that could be opened up later by someone else.

Readers of this thread may be interested to try the first beta implementation of Package in the latest Affinity Publisher Beta

You can find Affinity Publisher Customer Beta 1.9.0.796 for macOS HERE and for Windows HERE

If you are coming to this post late the latest customer beta can be found in the last post in the relevant one of these announcement threads on macOS or Windows

[wonderings]

15 minutes ago, Patrick Connor said:

Readers of this thread may be interested to try the first beta implementation of Package in the latest Affinity Publisher Beta

You can find Affinity Publisher Customer Beta 1.9.0.796 for macOS HERE and for Windows HERE

If you are coming to this post late the latest customer beta can be found in the last post in the relevant one of these announcement threads on macOS or Windows

Looks like some solid additions in the beta! I have been swamped here lately being short staffed due to COVID so have not played around with any recent betas, I will be checking out the data merge implementation as that is a pretty big feature.

[Queen Rarity]

I would like idml export, some of my clients use indesign and I sometimes have to send their files back to them after I have altered them. Having idml export would greatly increase my ability to help them.