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Wosven

Need visual clue for applier Master Page in MP & Page panels

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Hi,

We really need a fixed visual clue in the Pages panel to check or search easily which Masper Pages are applied by pages.

For example, in a book I use 3 MP :

  • A - Blank MP (only the main text frames linked, for title, details, etc.)
  • B - Chapter MP (main text frames with huge top margin for chapter title + pages numbers frame)
  • C - Text (main text frames  + pages numbers frame + title/author frame)

Once I flowed all the text using the Text MP (=> ± 300 pages), I apply the Chapter MP to each page containing the beginning of a chapter.
For now, all is OK, it's the first draw.

Next, I need to add/modify/edit the text: the flow is different, and I need to correct the applied  MP, since the Chapter MP and the Text MP didn't follow the new flow of text.

 

It's difficult to check easily where are applied the MP while scrolling through the Pages panel. I can enlarge the thumbnails, but scrolling won't be faster… Waiting for the helptip to show is a pain, and sometimes not accurate or fast.

 

Waiting for the tooltip…

2020-02-08_124556_cr.png.75903ac5729dace6f18a977b1bbc8aa5.png

 

Below, I can visually search for Chapter MP applied to plain text pages, but it's not easy, and it won't be as easy to find if there's no big visual differences in the pages (for example, only a different variable/text line at the top of the page: part + chapter title instead of author's name).

2020-02-08_130015_cr.png.d8623d0b2a6083c3f75ed9499e655bc1.png

 

Another example where the MP are rightly positioned: why does the tooltip show first the right page MP's name, and second the left page MP's name ? I usually read from left to right, and expect the tooltip to show LMP and RMP's names.

2020-02-08_124809_cr.png.e9ece6fd716f926277fe8bc50f92aa42.png

 

Visual clues could be inside the pages or outside.
On MP "C", visual clues would show as nothing or "A" or "A+B", etc. if different MP are applied on it, but on the pages it would only display "C" (or "C+D", etc. if there are more than 1 MP applied to the page).

2020-02-08_135319_cra.png.d15ce81e02480f220a6f34211faaebaf.png

 

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Quote

We really need a fixed visual cue in the Pages panel to check or search easily which Master Pages are applied by pages.

Absolutely agree … anything that requires to select a page or hover over a page is insufficient … 🙁

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If only you would use one or two real master pages on a page,that could work.
But since you can use mp's as repeating objects it would be a whole lot of indicators needed.
Besides the layerspanel indicates which mp's you're using on a page.
 

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I totally agree, too. – There already are various threads about improving the info given in Pages Panel since pre-retail beta.

For instance adding a colored edge or tiny symbols (see within swatch icons: global, overprint, spot) to the page icons and using the page names more flexible (incl. terminating the superficient word "page") might offer visual info simply and fast. Not to forget the option to add folders for custom page icon visibility and info about sections.

 

For the time being: @Wosven, did you try in app prefs the tooltip delay setting with a slider position left of the default white stroke underneath?

1290998845_Bildschirmfoto2020-02-08um15_01_53.jpg.8a82dcb526c8a365effdcab050efe0e4.jpg


macOS 10.14.6, Macbook Pro Retina 15" + Eizo 24", Affinity in Separated Mode (documents merged)

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3 hours ago, thomaso said:

did you try in app prefs the tooltip delay setting

At first, I thought it was a two edges sword problem and didn't wanted to be slow down with tooltips showing up everywhere, but after checking my settings, it seems to be already low! (And they 're displayed fastly, that's just that I think it's slower that reading data already diplayed on a screen and searching a break in a pattern as in AAAAA =/= AAACA).

2020-02-08_191439.png.28b1a5fe27a44f1e93a499b231558214.png

 

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4 hours ago, haakoo said:

1. But since you can use mp's as repeating objects it would be a whole lot of indicators needed.
2. Besides the layerspanel indicates which mp's you're using on a page.

1. Perhaps it can be disabled from the hamburger menu.

I'd rather have complexe and complete MPs using different MPs, than pages using a lot of MPs, so another one can easily use a document I created, and re-use MP if needed. If they need to go though a lot of MP to search pieces here and there an create anew a page they messed badly, it'll be more difficult than re-applying the complete "Edito MP", for example. 

And this will apply for me, when I'll open a document I work on once a year too… Sometimes it's already difficult to understand why we needed all those paragraph or character styles!

2. For this you need to be/click on a page. It won't be modified scrolling through the Pages panel.

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16 minutes ago, Wosven said:

tooltip (...) And they 're displayed fastly, (...) it's slower that reading data already diplayed on a screen and searching a break in a pattern as in AAAAA =/= AAACA

Interesting screenshot, it seems in Windows the default preset speed is different than in macOS, at least according to the position of the white line below. Nevertheless, you still have some blue reserve left; in case you want it pop up earlier just move it far to the left. In my trial then it pops up immediately.

I agree to the recognition and reading speed of your pattern sample. But I doubt most users would like to be limited to single letters as master page names. So I think the approach to show the master names permanently at the page icons would demand much space for this texts. Therefore I would appreciate a colored page icon edge (stripe or square) as indicator at master and document pages.

5 hours ago, haakoo said:

But since you can use mp's as repeating objects it would be a whole lot of indicators needed.

As Wovsen mentioned, it appears more useful to make master pages relating to each other than applying many masters to document pages. However, color code might even handle this, e.g. ...:

1391291923_pagespanelcolors.jpg.6767838c8a21632a1dde03b394f52a6b.jpg

This kind also could be used for section marking, either with specific colors only or shape or position.


macOS 10.14.6, Macbook Pro Retina 15" + Eizo 24", Affinity in Separated Mode (documents merged)

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6 minutes ago, Interior Book Design said:

For me, simple letter like in PagePlus, InDesign or QuarkXPress just do. Letters that can be switched on and off. But I need it, urgently.

Simple letters are not enough in APub. Unlike InDesign, APub allows you to mix and interlace master pages.


My Specs:
- Processor: AMD Phenom™ II X4 955 Processor 3.20 GHz- RAM: 8 GB
- Graphics card: NVIDIA GeForce GTS 250
- Monitor: SyncMaster F2380 (resolution 1920x1080)
- Operating system: Windows 10 Pro (1803) / 64 bit

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24 minutes ago, Michail said:

Simple letters are not enough in APub. Unlike InDesign, APub allows you to mix and interlace master pages.

Maybe I don't understand...ID has been able to base a master on another, combining them since version 1.0. What can be done with master pages has only increased since then.

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12 hours ago, MikeW said:

Maybe I don't understand...ID has been able to base a master on another, combining them since version 1.0. What can be done with master pages has only increased since then.

Maybe my English isn't so sophisticated. Master pages can be based on each other. But in my opinion it is not possible to apply several master pages directly to one page. If that were possible, Adobe would have to come up with a different naming system as well. The prefix principle within the thumbnails would then no longer work.


My Specs:
- Processor: AMD Phenom™ II X4 955 Processor 3.20 GHz- RAM: 8 GB
- Graphics card: NVIDIA GeForce GTS 250
- Monitor: SyncMaster F2380 (resolution 1920x1080)
- Operating system: Windows 10 Pro (1803) / 64 bit

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