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Can we do software requests? possible Lightroom alternative?

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As an Aperture orphan I am extremely encouraged by the fact that Affinity Photo seems to be able to read all my Aperture edits straight from the Aperture library, including curves and local adjustments - unlike the contenders. If the future Affinity DAM has the same capability + the quality of Affinity Photo, it looks like the safe haven I've been looking for. When can we expect it..?

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I'd also love an update on this.

 

I'm holding off moving to (either) Mylio or Capture One (from Aperture, via a disastrous Lightroom transition).

 

Is 2016 realistic to see something?

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Migration

 
I look forward to using a Digital Asset Management System that will be superior to that in Lightroom.  However, migrating from one to another will have consequences, some of which will be unavoidable, so I'd like to begin tidying the mess I’ve created in LR in order to ease this process.  
 
For example: I'd like to know if I'd be wasting my time creating Collections, Smart Collections or Collection Sets.  What filename convention would be appropriate?  Then there's the Keyword structure and other meta data to think about.  What will migrate and what won't?
 
Please could you release some advance information / suggestions / advice that could be helpful.  I’ve no idea when you will release a public beta, but I do know it is likely to take me many months to prepare.

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Please can we have a DAM edition to Affinity Photo, which I have started using, it's a great piece of software and therefore I don't want to rely on Aperture or go back to Lightroom.

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It is not just the DAM that is needed, the entire RAW editing needs an overhaul, which I understand is in hand. LR with ACR is a long, long way in front of Affinity Photo so far as RAW editing is concerned. I see the problem being that LR is pretty much all that is required for touching up photos (raw or otherwise) with PS only being required for more advanced editing work. If Affinity constructs a similar sort of DAM it kind of makes AP unnecessary for most basic editing work. It will be interesting to see how all this develops.

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Hi,

 

looking forward to see the BETA :)

 

If I may already post a feature request ... please make the DAM NAS ready, so that the catalog or DB is accessible to multiple user, which would give you already 1000 extra points over the flagship Lightroom :)

 

Many thanks!

Cheers

JK

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Hi, I'm looking forward to your DAM once it is available. I hope it will be available on Mac and Windows simultaneously, but I fully understand that developing for both OSes at the same time may not be possible.

My issues with the currently available offerings (note: I was a long time user of Aperture who reluctantly switched to Lightroom when Aperture development was officially discontinued). I appreciate this is feedback from one user and that you will have a very large number of different opinions to consider!

Lightroom:

1. I don't enjoy switching between Library/Develop etc. modules. One interface for managing and applying edits would be excellent.

2. The Import process - aaaarrrrggghhh! I've been trialling Exposure X by Alien Skin and really like the way you can simply navigate files in folders, browse the images as if you are using Adobe Bridge, and then apply edits immediately without opening the files in a different application or having to import the images or having to change UI.

3. Exporting of images. This can take ages when exporting a large batch at the end of a big edit (ie a large number of images). Not great when in a hurry. I get around this by editing some images (eg 20 in succession), then exporting them in the background whilst I continue to edit the next 20 images. The change of thought process and UI from edit to export isn't an ideal workflow though. It would be great to have options for a 'quick export' shortcut (so an image is saved to a preset folder (and with file naming options too)) and another option which automatically exports an image when the user moves to the next image (ie no need to press the 'quick export' button at all) - this would be invaluable at events when a quick check/tweak of cropping and exposure are required (eg an event where the images are taken and then placed on view for the customers to choose their favourites and (hopefully) buy - at these events there simply isn't time to wait for the Lightroom import process and export process. Most event photographers shoot in jpg only for speed reasons (ie no time to process raw files to jpg before placing them on sale) and then use a hot folder with their event viewing software to show the images to their customers. For this reason the original file of an image in the 'hot folder' which is where the DAM will be editing the files will also be overwritten, so a copy of the original would (sensibly) be saved elsewhere - whether the DAM can handle this or the photographer simply has to create an 'Originals' folder elsewhere would need to be decided.

4. Touch friendly - touch screen computers (especially with Windows 2-in-1 machines) are becoming increasingly common. Lightroom is not touch friendly at all.

 

Capture 1 Pro:

I have similar issues with C1P as I do with Lightroom, but I find the interface even more confusing.

The raw conversion of C1P is simply superb. However, not a single client has ever complained about the file output of images from Lightroom. I suspect the difference in quality of outputted files between C1P and Lightroom matters most to photographers and somewhat less to our customers - a few customers may notice but I suspect they will be an absolute minority (and perhaps in very specific industries anyway eg. fashion and other studio based photography situations).

 

So in short. A DAM which works in a similar way to Exposure X, but has no import process and has instant saving of altered images, and also allows for presets of standard edits (exposure, keywords, etc.) to be applied with a single keystroke (no copy&paste of image settings or having to keypress&click to select images to 'sync settings', touch friendly, lightweight on system resources and good image quality would be amazing!

 

Something like a cross between Photo Mechanic, Bridge, and Exposure X - but with quick export/auto save when moving to the next image.

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Hmmm.

Many people think LR modal interface is cumbersome. I think it is just ok. Compare it to Affinity Photo – it's "persona" modality is certainly not easier!

Importing: That is ok too. Of course lesser import time is better, but is it technically possible alter images on the fly, having some kind of instant previews? 

Folder organizing in LR is a joke for sure, there is no ways to manage folders or their order. 

Non-destructive editing: I am not sure people understand that it is very different animal compared to plain vanilla pixel work. It just may be too hard to built application with instant non-destructive editing.

Exporting: for me the exporting is speedy enough. After all LR is building final images there, from the non-destructive edits.

Database: that is the main reason LR exists. Everything you ever have imported to LR is easy to find. (I just wish there would be a simple way to add keywords to images themselves – OS certainly supports keywords meta).

 

That said, I am quite sure there is going to be a lot of progress in non-destructive editing software in coming years. I am sure Affinity would make a good app with a lot of ground breaking features.

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I wish people would understand that a DAM is purely a way to organise and retrieve assets. These could be almost any type of file, including for eg a simple text file. To add in pixel or non-destructive functionality for images would be silly unless it could also edit all the other kinds of file. For images we have AP and for vectors we have AD. These, or any other specialised editor could also be launched. In other words, a DAM is simply a Bridge type application, but faster and far more flexible because it is using a backend database, such as SQL. I wish people would get their heads around this and stop asking for yet another LR / C1 / Aperture look a like. I'm sure the developers understand this, but it would be extremely helpful if they would publish some kind of advance information. If I'm wrong, I'll be looking elsewhere.

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I wish people would understand that a DAM is purely a way to organise and retrieve assets. These could be almost any type of file, including for eg a simple text file. To add in pixel or non-destructive functionality for images would be silly unless it could also edit all the other kinds of file....

I absolutely disagree with this.

 

In the context of photo management, a DAM must included both organisation and non-destructive editing. These are expected features these days and without them what's the point?

 

Fixx (post above) says "I am not sure people understand that it is very different animal compared to plain vanilla pixel work. It just may be too hard to built application with instant non-destructive editing.". I disagree with this too. People are very aware of the difference and it is clearly achievable as applications such as Aperture, Lightroom and Capture One demonstrate.

 

My view is that with the demise of Aperture, the market is crying out for a modern replacement. All current options fall down in one (or more) areas. Lightroom has an ancient UI and some poorly thought out workflow decisions. Capture One has only basic organisation functionality. Neither integrate with the macOS ecosystem well.

 

Anyone who nails it will have the market for their taking.

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I absolutely disagree with this.

 

 

A DAM is for organising assets.  Assets are everything to do with any particular project.  For example, a single project could include vector graphics, text notes, a word document, spreadsheet, video clips, music, or even a few links to websites on the Internet.  And lets not rule out newer technologies such as 3D imaging, that some are already using.  So, what possible use would a DAM that was so restricted to only useful in managing photos?  

 
However, I do agree it would be wonderful if such a system could be fully integrated into macOS.  Unfortunately, Windows compatibility will most likely prevent this.
 
Thanks for your comments and I hope more people will express their opinions.  It could be very helpful if the Affinity team would do the same.

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A DAM is for organising assets.  Assets are everything to do with any particular project.  For example, a single project could include vector graphics, text notes, a word document, spreadsheet, video clips, music, or even a few links to websites on the Internet.  And lets not rule out newer technologies such as 3D imaging, that some are already using.  So, what possible use would a DAM that was so restricted to only useful in managing photos?  

 
However, I do agree it would be wonderful if such a system could be fully integrated into macOS.  Unfortunately, Windows compatibility will most likely prevent this.
 
Thanks for your comments and I hope more people will express their opinions.  It could be very helpful if the Affinity team would do the same.

 

 

Mike,  perhaps the difference is between Organizing and Managing. DAM is asset management, which goes a few steps beyond simple organization.  Its primary goal where photos are concerned, at least from the birth of Aperture and Lightroom (as alternatives to Bridge) was to avoid file duplication wherever possible. That's the Management part. And it was particularly important for photographers who began seeing their hard drives quickly filled with duplicated files for every edit they made, even simple ones.  So Aperture (I think derived from Photo Mechanic or something like that) provided photogs with RAW processing and simple instruction based (non-destructive but more importantly non-constructive) pixel editing, which left the original file untouched and didn't duplicate it either, but rather saved an instruction set that was only applied in viewing or exporting a version of the image.  Add to that the ability to intelligently rate and organize projects, folders and albums, filtered searching and great batch processing, and you had an absolutely amazing, powerful tool that photographers loved.  Right up until Apple killed it and left us with the mess that is LR.  Capture One impressively picked up some of the slack, and even added editing layers and masks, but the price isn't so great and there's still room for improvement in their DAM implementation.

 

So while the ability to organize multiple file types is great (Aperture could mostly do this), managing the assets with intelligent filtering, RAW processing and basic editing is critical for photographers, and I imagine others would like it too.  The only thing I could add is that storage is always becoming cheaper, so maybe avoiding duplicates isn't so important as it used to be, although that gain is negated by the advent of expensive SSDs and ever growing RAW file sizes.  

 

Hope that helps to clarify why this is such an important feature for many of us.

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Mike,  perhaps the difference is between Organizing and Managing.

 

I think, tallrob, your thoughts are excellent and well presented.  I admit I’m probably not a typical photographer - especially so during recent years.  Around 2006 I began creating layered composites, combining multiple images.  More recently, I discovered the usefulness of vector graphics when Affinity Design became available.  Today, I’m also using acrylic paint over the top of prints and rephotographing these.  Managing these assets in LR is next to impossible.   I need something far more powerful.

 
As for keeping original untouched RAW files, I have my doubts as to why I bother and can’t recall ever needing to go back.  As a serious amateur, it comes down to the fact that my aspirations and abilities have improved over the years. I consider myself to be only as good as my recent work. 
 
I’m currently scanning thousands of transparencies and negatives from years gone by.  Most should have been thrown away at the time, but the nostalgic value of others far outweigh the inferior technical quality and my photographic ability of the time.  How I organise these will be challenging, because I can’t remember where most of them were taken, the names of some of the people, or the year they were taken.
 
I switched from Aperture to Lightroom a few years ago.  I regret doing that and sometimes wonder if I should switch back and pray.  Meanwhile, I continue to hope Affinity will deliver on their promise.  They originally promised a DAM for 2016.  Later, they said 2017.  Today, they don’t comment at all.

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They actually announced !news! regarding a DAM for 2016. (link to that post is in my signature)

You seem to mix this up with Affinity Publisher which was announced for 2016 and is now expected as a beta late 2016/ early 2017.


 

 

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I stand corrected.  Indeed they did announce a new DAM application for 21016 release.   I'll believe this when it happens, because they're way behind schedule with everything else.  Its far more probable Phase One will update Media Pro sooner, or even release a Capture One Pro version 10.   Meanwhile, Lightroom plods on as always.

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I found this thread via Google after spending too much time messing around with Lightroom serial numbers, phone homes, wiped hard drives, and more. The minute the Affinity DAM arrives I look forward to buying it.

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