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Hi,

first of all: I purchased all 3 Affinity Products - mainly to support Serif/Affinity.
I use Photo sometimes but Designer and Publisher nearly not at all.
...just in case some of you find my posting stupid.


While playing around with Publisher I noticed the following behavior in both, the release-Version and the most recent Beta:

When creating a new Document, we can set the preferred Image-Placement-Behavior.
Default is "prefer linked".

155487872_NewDocument.png.eb3d0da4216491ebf959c7a9fce0e2af.png

my first issue:
Its hard for me to unterstand, why there are 2 tools/methods for basically the same task: adding a Picture to the page:

  • Place Picture
  • Picture Frames


I do see, that both tools offer different options, but why not combine those 2 into 1?
I am sure there is a reason that can easily be explained by some power-Users of DTP-Software in this forum...

my second issue:
As soon as I use "replace image"  the file-open-dialog...

  1. looks different depending on which method was used before since only
    the "picture-Frame-Method" lets me choose between "embed or link"   and
     
  2. why isn´t "link Picture" the default-Option although I have chosen this in the "new document"-settings before (see above).

215060931_ChoosePicture.png.73a69017a6aee20cb2f1f1cba1d92fad.png

 

Thanks!

 

kind regards
Fritz

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On 11/1/2019 at 12:49 PM, Fritz_H said:

my first issue:
Its hard for me to unterstand, why there are 2 tools/methods for basically the same task: adding a Picture to the page:

  • Place Picture
  • Picture Frames

If you work on small project, you can embed a picture or a logo, you'll have a larger file size, but it's not a problem.

 

When you work on larger projects, you don't want huge file, but manageable ones you can easily send by email or give to a coworker easily. That's when linked files are interesting: you can have them in a shared folder, and someone else can modify them while you're working on the document, and you'll only have to update them later.

There's preview of those files in the document, you can move it to work on the text on another computer or while away from the office (no need to list or explain, but this can happen for diffferent reasons), or someone else, and when it'll be back in the original folder, it'll be able to find again the linked illustrations.

In professionnal work, we usually work with low resolution images, and when the client validate them, we buy the high resolution ones. Or we work with roughts of illustration. We only need to use the same file names to replace those files, or hide the low resolution folder… in few clics, we're able to update the images.

It wouldn't be possible with embedded ones, or more complicated.

With linked images, if your document is bugged, you don't loose the images, (but you do if you modified them inside the document if they are embedded). It's better to keep different versions of a document, but again, linked images is better since the document will be smaller.

---

About place pictures and picture frames:

APub is compatible with AD and AP file format, and you can open the document of one app in the other ones. Since there's only "placed images" in AP and AD, the option is also available in APub.

But in programs like APub, it's usually the Picture frames that people are used to. And picture frames have different interesting options.

 

On 11/1/2019 at 12:49 PM, Fritz_H said:

why isn´t "link Picture" the default-Option although I have chosen this in the "new document"-settings before (see above).

The default option should be the prefered option, or the one used by the image you want to replace, you're right.

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@Wosven 
Thanks for the explanation but I do understand the difference between "link" and "embed". 
I just have an issue to understand, why there are 2 Tools for the same Task.
But your reference to the other Affinity-Apps seems to be a good explanation...

Perhaps Serif should combine the 2 Picture-Tools into one and implement them into Designer and Photo too?
(since they seem to share large parts of the codebase...)

Thanks.

kind regards

Fritz

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34 minutes ago, Fritz_H said:

implement them into Designer and Photo too?

I'm not sure about this, since it's not usefull, and we'll be able to have them if we open an APub file in them, but perhaps not the specific options. And the same way AP and AD get specific features, some should stay in APub.

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Placing a picture and a picture frame are different so I don't really think merging them works. Picture Frames have their place as "placeholders" for pictures if creating template, or can be placed on a master page and different pictures placed in different pages, and so forth...

Your point about the link/embed option not defaulting to what is set in preferences is valid, I'm fairly certain this is logged with us but I'll double check and log it if not.

Edit: The linked/embed option on replace should be defaulting to the current linked/embedded status of the image that is being replaced


Serif Europe Ltd. - www.serif.com

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On 11/4/2019 at 5:18 PM, Jon P said:

Edit: The linked/embed option on replace should be defaulting to the current linked/embedded status of the image that is being replaced

@Jon P Thanks for the Update ("Edit: ...")

but:
- When placing an image via "Place Image Tool" the first time, there is no option to chose between link or embed.
- When using the Picture-Frame-Tool the default always is "embed picture" - regardless of the document settings or status of the image being replaced.

kind regards
Fritz

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9 minutes ago, Fritz_H said:

When placing an image via "Place Image Tool" the first time, there is no option to chose between link or embed.

For the initial placement of an image, Linked/Embedded is determined by the preference you set for the document when you created it. It should not matter whether you are placing the image into a picture frame or directly onto the page.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

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10 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

For the initial placement of an image, Linked/Embedded is determined by the preference you set for the document when you created it. It should not matter whether you are placing the image into a picture frame or directly onto the page.

Hi @walt.farrell

OK, How about: you want to use the Place-Image-Tool to add an image intentionally NOT following the default-Settings?
Place it and replace-it just to get access to the chooser in the file-dialog?

not very handy. They should add these radio-buttons to every method of choosing a picture - no matter which tool is used.
open.png.b1360e5e383fea18006da0d582b69201.png
It should default to either the settings of the document (at first time placement) or to the properties of the replaced image.

But that´s exactly what the "Picture frame Tool" does not.

kind regards
Fritz

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5 minutes ago, Fritz_H said:

But that´s exactly what the "Picture frame Tool" does not.

The Picture Frame Tool only draws a picture frame. It does nothing with respect to getting a picture into your document, and only controls the capabilities you have to manipulate the picture once it is in the document.

Getting a picture into the document is entirely handled by File > Place, or the Place Image Tool, or drag/drop, or copy/paste.

I agree that it would be convenient to have the embed/link option available when using File > Place or the Place Image Tool. However, I'm not sure I see a good reason for having a mixture of embedded and linked images. I think I would probably choose one or the other, and I suspect I would choose Linked in most cases.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

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6 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

The Picture Frame Tool only draws a picture frame. It does nothing with respect to getting a picture into your document, and only controls the capabilities you have to manipulate the picture once it is in the document.

Regarding "Embed vs Link" the Picture Frame Tool should respect the document´s default settings - it does not.
When replacing the Image it should respect the settings of the image being replaced (see posting of "Jon P" above) - it does not.

kind regards
Fritz

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4 minutes ago, Fritz_H said:

Regarding "Embed vs Link" the Picture Frame Tool should respect the document´s default settings - it does not.

Again, the Picture Frame Tool does not do anything about putting images into a document. This Tool only creates picture frames, and only affects the capabilities you have of using images once you load them into the document.

You may be saying that Placing an image (for the first time) into a Picture Frame is behaving differently for you than Placing one (for the first time) onto the page without using a Picture Frame. But if that's what you're saying, I do not see that. If my document is set to prefer embedding, I can Place an image directly onto the page, or into a Picture frame, and both are embedded. If set to prefer linking, I can Place an image directly onto the page, or into a Picture Frame, and both are linked.

But, again, the Picture Frame Tool is irrelevant here. And proper use of terminology is important.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

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@walt.farrell 

perhaps its a language-gap - thing which makes it hard for me to explain...

Please try the following:

  • New Document - Image placement policy "prefer linked"
  • use the picture frame tool
  • click in the "replace image" - Button
  • check the Placement-Settings in the File-Open - Dialog: its always set to "embed" - never to "linked" as is should based on the document-defaults.

see?

kind regards
Fritz

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6 minutes ago, Fritz_H said:

@walt.farrell 

perhaps its a language-gap - thing which makes it hard for me to explain...

Please try the following:

  • New Document - Image placement policy "prefer linked"
  • use the picture frame tool
  • click in the "replace image" - Button
  • check the Placement-Settings in the File-Open - Dialog: its always set to "embed" - never to "linked" as is should based on the document-defaults.

see?

Thanks. Yes, that is clear.

It is not an issue with the Picture Frame Tool, though. It is an isue with the Picture Frame and the Replace Image button in the Context Toolbar for a Picture Frame.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

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1 hour ago, walt.farrell said:

Thanks. Yes, that is clear.

It is not an issue with the Picture Frame Tool, though. It is an isue with the Picture Frame and the Replace Image button in the Context Toolbar for a Picture Frame.

hi @walt.farrell

Thanks for having taken the time to test this.

As far as I can say, the issue only occurs in combination of "Picture Frames" and "Replace Image"-Button.
When using this button on/with (?) a placed Image ("Place Image Tool") it works correctly.

Fritz

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24 minutes ago, Fritz_H said:

When using this button on/with (?) a placed Image ("Place Image Tool") it works correctly.

Not completely correct. You could use the Place Image Tool to place an image directly onto a page, or to place an image into a Picture Frame. It is the same tool (Place Image) in either case.

The Replace Image button operates correctly (assumes the document preferenct for Linked vs Embedded) if you use it with an image placed directly onto a page. It operates incorrectly (assumes Embedded) when used with a Picture Frame. In both cases, the images were placed using the same tool (Place Image).


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

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